OHSAA FOOTBALL PLAYOFFS ?

[CheeseBurger]

Not like the days of old locked down
Enrollment. Oak hill was the only school I knew of with open enrollment ie “out district “ players students guess they all do now?

The wave of the present and future

No doubt but that still doesn’t make it right but we all know why to allow public schools to compete with private. OHSAA will never be on a level playing field. Just lump it if ya don’t like it. Recruiting is a sad but true part of most all successful programs. I know I am beating a dead horse. But it’s late I can’t sleep brain is in overdrive this time of year 17 hrs and counting. Here it comes!

[FANOSPORTS]

So are you wanting them to go back to 4 teams or what??

In a nutshell yes but it'll never happen. Once something is set into place it seems to just keep rolling like a freight train so all you can do is hope the brakes work and it doesn't crash.

I'll be honest there's times when I do think it'd be nicer to go back to the 4 team setup, I know most won't agree but it was more prestiges to make it at that point. Teams had to find a happy medium when scheduling because to soft a schedule you weren't getting in, there were plenty of teams going 9-1 and 10-0 not make it. Now it seems like teams that just have a so so year have a shot at making it especially if you find yourself in the right region. To counter that it does give us more football and some games are quality games, some yeah not so much. Like you said though that train has left the station and isn't returning. I'd love for them to fix the region break down, if that's even possible, just because there's no reason to have teams driving 3-4 hrs in the 1st round to play a team within their own region.

I agree wholeheartedly. I traditionally up until about 6 years ago I went to all the state final games every year for probably 18 years, spent the whole weekend there and had a good time. Years before that I'd take in a Wheelersburg or Ironton championship game or two when they went. I was at OSU when both of them won in 89'. I followed DeSales for a few years in the 90's as a friend of mines son played for them and we would travel on the bus or in vehicles to various games with a couple coaches and parents and had some great times. Funny story now but not then, back in 1992 or 1993 DeSales played Ironton @ Lancaster in the playoffs and my friends son was the rb and got a concussion in the first half. DeSales won the game but he said he played the whole 2nd half and didn't remember any of it. He said that game was the hardest he'd been hit all year. A few other years I had another friend who kept stats for Sheridan so I got to know Coach Paul Culver and did some sideline roaming, traveling, etc. with them also to various reg. season and playoff games over the years. High school football to me is still a great amatuer sport but too many changes from the adults in charge have soured me a bit on it.

[Jokerswild]

You can argue the point of having a better season should be a point of emphasis and go back to 4 teams. But Philo has beat the #1 as a #8 see in 2016 and the 2 and 3 seed as a 7 seed last year before being beat by a 5 seed. So yes, the expansion has allowed more good teams in. Should they expand even more, no since there are blowouts already. Philo did embarrass the 1 seed 42-7 so it does go both ways.

[enigmaax]

The creation of D7 was a mistake. I think the system was better off with only D1-D6. Even the state championships got so bloated that they had to add a Thursday game to accomodate all the divisions. As it has been mentioned here and on other sites, it seems that the expansion was not really made to help out the small schools, but rather to take pressure off of the D1 schools. Right now there are a lot of schools who are in D2 who should really be in D1.

It's obvious how this just waters down the divisions. Teams that made the playoffs once every 10 years or had never even made the playoffs before now get in routinely. This is the equivalent of the "give every kid a trophy" mentality that plagues sports these days.

Having 7 State Champions among 600+ schools, where each one is earned by winning half the number of regular season contests and competing against reasonably similar sized schools is “giving every kid a trophy”? Sorry, that is just a ridiculous statement.

[FANOSPORTS]

The creation of D7 was a mistake. I think the system was better off with only D1-D6. Even the state championships got so bloated that they had to add a Thursday game to accomodate all the divisions. As it has been mentioned here and on other sites, it seems that the expansion was not really made to help out the small schools, but rather to take pressure off of the D1 schools. Right now there are a lot of schools who are in D2 who should really be in D1.

It's obvious how this just waters down the divisions. Teams that made the playoffs once every 10 years or had never even made the playoffs before now get in routinely. This is the equivalent of the "give every kid a trophy" mentality that plagues sports these days.

Having 7 State Champions among 600+ schools, where each one is earned by winning half the number of regular season contests and competing against reasonably similar sized schools is “giving every kid a trophy”? Sorry, that is just a ridiculous statement.

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

[enigmaax]

The creation of D7 was a mistake. I think the system was better off with only D1-D6. Even the state championships got so bloated that they had to add a Thursday game to accomodate all the divisions. As it has been mentioned here and on other sites, it seems that the expansion was not really made to help out the small schools, but rather to take pressure off of the D1 schools. Right now there are a lot of schools who are in D2 who should really be in D1.

It's obvious how this just waters down the divisions. Teams that made the playoffs once every 10 years or had never even made the playoffs before now get in routinely. This is the equivalent of the "give every kid a trophy" mentality that plagues sports these days.

Having 7 State Champions among 600+ schools, where each one is earned by winning half the number of regular season contests and competing against reasonably similar sized schools is “giving every kid a trophy”? Sorry, that is just a ridiculous statement.

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

I guess I just don’t understand the travesty of giving kids a chance. Even winning a single playoff game, especially pulling an upset, creates an experience for hundreds/thousands of people. It isn’t a trophy, it is an opportunity to win a trophy and only 7 of those 200+ schools get that. The others, get to work hard for an extra week or few, and see where they stack up against the best. As far as percentage of participants, almost literally every single other sport and level of competition opens its championship tournament to at least the same pool (CFP being the obvious exception and people whine tirelessly about how that field needs to expand). Welcome to America, we like big tournaments and in high school sports it makes particular sense because there’s no scheduling balance at all.

[FANOSPORTS]

Having 7 State Champions among 600+ schools, where each one is earned by winning half the number of regular season contests and competing against reasonably similar sized schools is “giving every kid a trophy”? Sorry, that is just a ridiculous statement.

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

I guess I just don’t understand the travesty of giving kids a chance. Even winning a single playoff game, especially pulling an upset, creates an experience for hundreds/thousands of people. It isn’t a trophy, it is an opportunity to win a trophy and only 7 of those 200+ schools get that. The others, get to work hard for an extra week or few, and see where they stack up against the best. As far as percentage of participants, almost literally every single other sport and level of competition opens its championship tournament to at least the same pool (CFP being the obvious exception and people whine tirelessly about how that field needs to expand). Welcome to America, we like big tournaments and in high school sports it makes particular sense because there’s no scheduling balance at all.

Yes, kids and communities rightfully so are always elated during this time of year if they're chosen for the playoffs. I just think personally that a lot of exploitation for greed and more $$$$ has reared it's ugly head in the OHSAA over the years much like in politics and corporate america . It's more like a business than ever and you sometimes wonder what leverage is used and what factors into their decision making processes.

[enigmaax]

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

I guess I just don’t understand the travesty of giving kids a chance. Even winning a single playoff game, especially pulling an upset, creates an experience for hundreds/thousands of people. It isn’t a trophy, it is an opportunity to win a trophy and only 7 of those 200+ schools get that. The others, get to work hard for an extra week or few, and see where they stack up against the best. As far as percentage of participants, almost literally every single other sport and level of competition opens its championship tournament to at least the same pool (CFP being the obvious exception and people whine tirelessly about how that field needs to expand). Welcome to America, we like big tournaments and in high school sports it makes particular sense because there’s no scheduling balance at all.

Yes, kids and communities rightfully so are always elated during this time of year if they're chosen for the playoffs. I just think personally that a lot of exploitation for greed and more $$$$ has reared it's ugly head in the OHSAA over the years much like in politics and corporate america . It's more like a business than ever and you sometimes wonder what leverage is used and what factors into their decision making processes.

I mean, things cost money to operate. Everything that makes a little money isn't necessarily driven by greed. And even when someone stands to gain a bit financially, there can be tremendous peripheral benefits that make it worth it. I'd say a lot of people win in this case, some financially, maybe. But it sounds like your argument was never really about watered down competition, but about a bone to pick with how the OHSAA makes money. There could certainly be some bad decisions, but the experiences provided to Ohio high school athletes are pretty high quality.

[Otto]

The creation of D7 was a mistake. I think the system was better off with only D1-D6. Even the state championships got so bloated that they had to add a Thursday game to accomodate all the divisions. As it has been mentioned here and on other sites, it seems that the expansion was not really made to help out the small schools, but rather to take pressure off of the D1 schools. Right now there are a lot of schools who are in D2 who should really be in D1.

It's obvious how this just waters down the divisions. Teams that made the playoffs once every 10 years or had never even made the playoffs before now get in routinely. This is the equivalent of the "give every kid a trophy" mentality that plagues sports these days.

Having 7 State Champions among 600+ schools, where each one is earned by winning half the number of regular season contests and competing against reasonably similar sized schools is “giving every kid a trophy”? Sorry, that is just a ridiculous statement.

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

Exactly. It's a participation trophy for these teams by letting them in when they didn't really earn it. Let's look at D7 as an example. FOUR teams made the playoffs at 5-5 and TWO made it at 6-4. Now, did these teams really earn their way in? I don't think so. Especially when you look and see that most of these wins came from beating just awful teams. Ten years ago, these 6 teams would not have made the playoffs, and I guarantee you none of them will win the championship this year.

[Cats claw]

Having 7 State Champions among 600+ schools, where each one is earned by winning half the number of regular season contests and competing against reasonably similar sized schools is “giving every kid a trophy”? Sorry, that is just a ridiculous statement.

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

Exactly. It's a participation trophy for these teams by letting them in when they didn't really earn it. Let's look at D7 as an example. FOUR teams made the playoffs at 5-5 and TWO made it at 6-4. Now, did these teams really earn their way in? I don't think so. Especially when you look and see that most of these wins came from beating just awful teams. Ten years ago, these 6 teams would not have made the playoffs, and I guarantee you none of them will win the championship this year.

If you don't like these first round games don't go watch them problem solved

[Tjhtygeverve]

Misguided post, the expansion to a 7th division really did not increase revenue. What it did do was create more balance and opportunities for the largest and smallest schools.

Absolutely, SPOT ON!

[HamPorter]

Those losers from Rocky River wouldn’t have gotten in if it were up to me and only got lucky that the money hungry state allowed them in as an 8 seed. They showed how big of a joke they are by lucking into a 10 point win tonight over a 1 seed.

[FANOSPORTS]

Those losers from Rocky River wouldn’t have gotten in if it were up to me and only got lucky that the money hungry state allowed them in as an 8 seed. They showed how big of a joke they are by lucking into a 10 point win tonight over a 1 seed.

Much like Iowa and Purdue the last 2 years huh ? "Even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometimes"

[Jokerswild]

Uh, another 7 seed(Tri Valley) goes and beats a 2 seed. And a 6 seed(Sheridan) goes and beats a 3 seed.
Boy, these expanded playoffs sure do make for some watered down football.......

[enigmaax]

Having 7 State Champions among 600+ schools, where each one is earned by winning half the number of regular season contests and competing against reasonably similar sized schools is “giving every kid a trophy”? Sorry, that is just a ridiculous statement.

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

Exactly. It's a participation trophy for these teams by letting them in when they didn't really earn it. Let's look at D7 as an example. FOUR teams made the playoffs at 5-5 and TWO made it at 6-4. Now, did these teams really earn their way in? I don't think so. Especially when you look and see that most of these wins came from beating just awful teams. Ten years ago, these 6 teams would not have made the playoffs, and I guarantee you none of them will win the championship this year.

Just last year, Minster went from 6-4 to state champs, winning the last three games by a combined 92-14.

Most people talk about winning it “on the field.” The less teams that make it, the less teams have a chance to win it on the field. It is funny that someone mentioned earlier how difficult it was to win a title back when only 4 teams oer class made it. No, it was more difficult to get a chance to play for it on the field because only a few teams were selected by an arbitrary math formula. Nothing about the Harbin system ensures the best team makes it; the teams whose opponents hapoen to win more games - regardless of competition - make the cut. A bigger field does open the door for both outmatched opponents AND very good teams who play a tough schedule who are incentivised to continue testing themselves against bugger/better opponents in the regular season (even with the risk of losing a few).

[FANOSPORTS]

The "trophy" to most is just being 1 of the 224 teams in the playoffs when realistically speaking only about 1/3 of that total is a true contender or have a punchers chance to get the title.

Exactly. It's a participation trophy for these teams by letting them in when they didn't really earn it. Let's look at D7 as an example. FOUR teams made the playoffs at 5-5 and TWO made it at 6-4. Now, did these teams really earn their way in? I don't think so. Especially when you look and see that most of these wins came from beating just awful teams. Ten years ago, these 6 teams would not have made the playoffs, and I guarantee you none of them will win the championship this year.

Just last year, Minster went from 6-4 to state champs, winning the last three games by a combined 92-14.

Most people talk about winning it “on the field.” The less teams that make it, the less teams have a chance to win it on the field. It is funny that someone mentioned earlier how difficult it was to win a title back when only 4 teams oer class made it. No, it was more difficult to get a chance to play for it on the field because only a few teams were selected by an arbitrary math formula. Nothing about the Harbin system ensures the best team makes it; the teams whose opponents hapoen to win more games - regardless of competition - make the cut. A bigger field does open the door for both outmatched opponents AND very good teams who play a tough schedule who are incentivised to continue testing themselves against bugger/better opponents in the regular season (even with the risk of losing a few).

And I would venture to say Minster @ 7-3 is the favorite this year also. (The MAC is a completely different beast week to week in the regular season let alone the playoffs, amazing)

[Railroadn]

Hey you stats guys how many regional finals have came from 5-8 seed. This should let us know if it was worth it. I would assume it’s a bunch and proves why it needed expanded in the first place. This is why I would assume it was needed.

In 1999 ironton made it as a #8 seed with a 6-3 record and went to the state championship. They beat Cincinnati Wyoming, Cincinnati Indian hill, German town Valley View, Youngstown Mooney, and played Sandusky Perkins in the state championship.

[Otto]

Uh, another 7 seed(Tri Valley) goes and beats a 2 seed. And a 6 seed(Sheridan) goes and beats a 3 seed.
Boy, these expanded playoffs sure do make for some watered down football.......

Oh, you mean "state runner-up" Tri Valley who went 9-1 in the regular season? Or Sheridan who also went 9-1 (including beating 3 teams with a 7-3 record)? Boy, you are doing a poor job of portraying these teams as heavy underdogs....

[55buckeyes98]

Why does every school get in the tournament in basketball and baseball then? I'd say the more teams we can let in the better. If you keep limiting the teams you let into the playoffs the regular season would become a joke, teams would not schedule anyone good outside of their conference or start scheduling more canadian and club teams... Here is an example... Newark Catholic is D6 and ended the season around 3-7 I think, but if you put them in the playoffs after the schedule they played I bet they could win a game or two in the 8 game format. Do they not deserve a shot because they play a pretty tough schedule? Does only your record tell your story? I'm surprised any football fanatic would say less games to watch is better...

[Jokerswild]

Uh, another 7 seed(Tri Valley) goes and beats a 2 seed. And a 6 seed(Sheridan) goes and beats a 3 seed.
Boy, these expanded playoffs sure do make for some watered down football.......

Oh, you mean "state runner-up" Tri Valley who went 9-1 in the regular season? Or Sheridan who also went 9-1 (including beating 3 teams with a 7-3 record)? Boy, you are doing a poor job of portraying these teams as heavy underdogs....

Just stating a fact of lower seeds winning. Yes there is no doubt there are undeserving teams making it in with the playoffs being expanded but obviously there are good teams that are left out when 4 teams made it.