AND THEN THERE WERE FOUR (PER DIVISION) ~ STATE SEMIS

[pappy1]

The lower seeds have won in the past, but I don't think to this degree.
Maybe it will be another year when an 8 seed wins it all.
I just read that the Cleveland Plain Dealer was picking Woodridge 9-2 over Girard 11-0.
Girard is the #2 team and Woodridge the #6 team in region 13.
I am headed that way Sat. rooting for Woodridge, hope the prediction is correct.

[Heavy D]

Thats why they let 8 in for all the regions. I suppose telling the 8's they made it in, but jus stay home cause we know you cant beat the 1's would be better jus so it dont make the harbin look bad?

[pappy1]

The success of the #8 seeds will have many who finished lower debating adding more teams to the playoffs.

[caglewis]

Stating only the #1-#8 ranking may not provide the whole story. Many times the actual point spread is very small - sometimes just fractions of a point separate all 8 teams. I think the computer system is way better than using subjective polls or assigning playoff slots by League. And you know the old cliche about "any given day......and that's why they play the games" got to be a cliche because it's true! As multiple area teams can attest, ranking is irrelevant on game day!

[Heavy D]

The success of the #8 seeds will have many who finished lower debating adding more teams to the playoffs.

And they will be the same ones that say the state is jus trying to make more money if that ever happens. So I guess they shouldnt even have playoffs. Just crown the team in each division with the most points state champions. Kind of like when Massilon won all their championships.

[superblue]

This happens every year, 4ever.... Cody Lanes senior year I did the same research & if I remember right the lower seeded team won around 60% of the first round games... Just remember there is no human involvement with the play-off system.... The computer does all the so called seeding.... Remember the last time I-town played in the championship game.. They barely made it in that year and were a #8 seed... But everyone knew they were the team to beat..."TWO 5-5 teams in the regular season remain alive: DVI Shadyside & Maria Stein Marion Local, who was a #5 seed." 2 or 3 years ago these two teams met in the state finals.. To me the playoffs are just a crap shoot and little attention should be paid to the seeding.. Look at Logan, they talked all year about a rematch with Louisville, (#1 in state poll & #1 seed in the region.) And they were beaten in the first Rd... OH WELL.................

[Heavy D]

Bring the human element in to the mix and teams from this area will rarely if ever make the playoffs.

[pappy1]

gahs4ever.....I didn't intend to make a federal case out of your post.
I do think it is a very interesting topic.
There has been at least one #8 seed win a state championship.
This years first round results are a good point to argue for those who want to expand the number of teams in the playoffs.
I would love to see a feasable way to expand the football playoffs.
I have yet to see what I thought was a good way to do it.
If it were expanded, there would be more first round blowouts.
There would come a time when a seed lower than 8 would win a championship.
The playoffs are a great experience for the players, coaches and fans.
The more that have that experience, the better.
I think the computerized point system is the only way to select the participants.

[Winchell]

I personally think 8 teams are too much. When the playoffs involved 4 teams per region, nearly every team was capable of making a run. With 8, not only can you "limp in" and be forced to travel hours away for someone else's home game, but the quality of said games overall are poor. When 4 per region played neutral site games, good quality football was played. Also, teams and communities didn't have to travel a day long journey. Furthermore, if you didn't play a solid schedule, you had to go 9-1 minimum to make it. Sometimes 10-0 didn't cut it. However, if you played a solid schedule, you could still make it with a lesser record due to second level points and so forth. To me, if anything, shrink it back down to 4.

[pappy1]

winchell.......you make some valid points, however there are points against your view.

Teams below the four seed have won state championships.
The less teams in, the greater chance of a championship team being left out.
The less teams in, the more teams, coaches and fans are denied the experience.

[Daniel Larusso]

I think the playoff format is just perfect the way it is now. If you expand it to the top 16 per region you are just going to get more blowouts, and teams that are not worthy. I always thought 4 teams wasn't enough because there were some great teams getting left out. 8 is just right, and Ohio has the best system in the country for deciding the top 8 per region.

If you go anywhere from 10-0 to 8-2 and don't make the playoffs. One of three things probably happened. One you are probably too big to be playing in the league you are in. Two you probably scheduled some cupcake non-league games. Three sometimes it just isn't your year, and everyone you play even if they are normally good programs are down.

[Steely Dan]

I think the playoff format is just perfect the way it is now. If you expand it to the top 16 per region you are just going to get more blowouts, and teams that are not worthy. I always thought 4 teams wasn't enough because there were some great teams getting left out. 8 is just right, and Ohio has the best system in the country for deciding the top 8 per region.

If you go anywhere from 10-0 to 8-2 and don't make the playoffs. One of three things probably happened. One you are probably too big to be playing in the league you are in. Two you probably scheduled some cupcake non-league games. Three sometimes it just isn't your year, and everyone you play even if they are normally good programs are down.

Daniel - I must agree with you here, these are basically the scenarios that result in people crying "injustice", "we got screwed", etc. Teams fall into one of the three, and through a state of denial, don't like looking in the mirror and admitting it!!!

[qualified101]

for the folks that think 8 teams are too many, maybe take 6 teams and the top two teams get a bye week. food for thought.

[caglewis]

I think the playoff format is just perfect the way it is now. If you expand it to the top 16 per region you are just going to get more blowouts, and teams that are not worthy. I always thought 4 teams wasn't enough because there were some great teams getting left out. 8 is just right, and Ohio has the best system in the country for deciding the top 8 per region.

If you go anywhere from 10-0 to 8-2 and don't make the playoffs. One of three things probably happened. One you are probably too big to be playing in the league you are in. Two you probably scheduled some cupcake non-league games. Three sometimes it just isn't your year, and everyone you play even if they are normally good programs are down.

I ABSOLUTELY AGREE!!! 8 is just right!!!! And the computer point system is also the most fair and objective system available for ranking and choosing the playoff teams.
I think OHIO has developed a terrific - and fair - system which sends 192 out of 700+ total teams [about 1/4] to the playoffs and ends up crowning 6 State Champions based on school size.
And why is "making money" off ticket sales somehow "wrong" for OHSAA or any individual school? Our school systems and facilities and the necessary governing bodies are primarily supported by "taxes" - so any event that "pays for itself" [or even possibly turns a profit] means a little less taxpayer money needed, right? And, besides, an under $10.00 ticket to anything is an absolute bargain!!!
And having TV coverage of all those final championship games is absolutely amazing!! I think OHSAA has done a fine job of organizing the way in which we determine State Champions in all sports.

[91blue14]

when you have #8 beating #1 you cant complain to much. you just have to take care of business. this system is much better than the college one lol.

making the cut is a big deal for the internet world.

[Westfan]

I would like to see 12 in and give the top 4 byes. The quality of football in the 1st and 2nd round would be better.

This would also give teams reason to play a tougher schedule because you could loose 3 or 4 games if your schedule is tough, and still get in. This would make the regular season better also.

Look at the kentucky playoffs this year, Ashland was 9-1 and got whooped by Dixie Heights who was about .500. But they played all those big schools around Cincinnati/Newport. In Ohio they probably wouldn't have made it doing this as a D2 or D3 school.

Year-year-out we see teams get in that aren't deserving because they play a bad schedule but go 9-1 or 10-0. Where teams that play a good schedule sometimes get penalized. You could play Logan 5 overtimes and loose 50-49, and another team could beat Manchester the same way and their win is worth more. Something seems wrong with that.

Taking 4 teams? What if you are a 5-5 D6 Marion Local team playing in the MAC against St. Henry, Coldwater, Delphos St. Johns, Vesailles, Anna, etc. Is taking 4 fair?

[4 HORSEMEN]

The computer points are definately a less than "perfect" way of choosing who makes the playoffs and who doesn't, but I really do think that it is the best that we have.

At least you understand HOW the points will work. If you schedule GOOD teams who you know will BEAT other good teams, and you WIN........ You will get the points you need.

If you don't, you won't

If we added the "HUMAN" element, I am afraid you would get too many teams scheduling cupcakes and beating them by 50, just to impress the voters. (Not everyone gets the chance to see all teams play, so the only thing they would be going by is stat lines and teams/coaches would just schedule and play to those lines).

Computer points allow you to schedule big, lose a few games but still have a shot at the playoffs (and many of those teams have a lot of success). I remember several years ago, Desailes finished 5-5, made the playoffs as a lower seed, and made it all the way to the state finals. (This was no fluke, they had scheduled up, played an extremely tough schedule and were rewarded with a shot at the playoffs).

..... As far as expanding the playoffs..... No, I don't want to see it. We already have too many teams getting in that ar sub-par. I really don't think there are too many scenarious where very good, legit teams, DON'T get in. Schedule better and win...... The points will take care of themselves :!:

[Paladin]

The playoffs are fine just the way they are.

[maniac66]

I agree scheduling is tough at times and the better you are the harder it is but if you look at Athens who switched leagues and went 9-1 and missed playoffs. Why because they played competition alot smaller than them. Ironton went 5-5 one year went to the championship and probley should have won it. And as for them leagues with 8,9 or 10 teams in it then they need to do what some others like the soc did make two divisions. 8 teams are plenty enough and as far as teams having injuries or starting slow that is part of football that is why it is a team sport and not a individual in basketball one player can make a difference in football it takes more than one player to win. Everyone knows the road to get to the playoffs and as the show went 8 is enough in this case win or lose all that matters is did you win enough to make it and was your schedule helpful enough to push you to the end goal.

[Daniel Larusso]

I agree scheduling is tough at times and the better you are the harder it is but if you look at Athens who switched leagues and went 9-1 and missed playoffs.

Athens enjoyed a tremendous turnaround this past year under Coach Adams, and I couldnt be happier for them, but I respectively submit that had the DII Bulldogs remained in the SEOAL, their 9-1 would have been closer to 5-5 if even that. Logan and Ironton would be definite butt kickings, and Warren, Jackson, and Portsmouth would have been difficult to beat as well.

I know travel was mentioned in Athens decision to leave the SEOAL and that has been discussed ad nauseum on here and frankly their leaving is their business and no one else's. And if league trophies is their goal, the TVC is a good fit for them. However, that league can never prepare them for the DII playoffs, and even if they ever make it in, they are certainly looking at a one and out, and probably another butt kicking in the process.

Case in point....look at their region (DII-7) and tell me who you think they could have competed with had they made it in. Heck, Logan is in their region and as great a team as theyve had the past five years, the playoff wins have been hard to come by.

Good post 4 ever! You pretty much hit the ball out of the park on this one.