Pfloyd's Elite 8 of Southern/SouthEast Ohio - Week #4

[danicalifornia]

It blows my mind that you have Marietta 3 spots below Warren. I know this is just a personal ranking and there's no real skin in this (thank god), but Marietta's win vs. Massillon Perry is better than any win Warren has, they have not lost any games, and they have both pretty equally dominated the common opponents. There is no data point that constitutes Warren being ranked above Marietta, much less multiple spots.

Marietta has played the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in all of division 2, including the easiest in the SE District. Perry has 2 wins and those teams they’ve beaten have a combined 2 wins. Bloom Carroll is a better win than Perry.

Marietta may be better, which I believe will be found out in about 10 days, but it isn’t egregious for them to be a couple of spots below Warren right now.

[mattash]

I should be caught up now, let me know if something is missing

SEO BASKETBALL STANDINGS 2023-24
Pos Team W L PF PA DIFF
1 Fairfield 9 0 60 40 20
2 Marietta 8 0 62 36 26
3 South Webster 8 0 69 47 21
4 New Lexington 9 1 55 41 14
5 Vinton County 7 1 64 41 23
6 Minford 7 1 65 47 18
7 Washington 7 1 61 47 13
8 Hillsboro 6 1 59 45 14
8 Wheelersburg 6 1 66 53 14
10 Ironton 6 1 71 58 13
11 Portsmouth 6 1 66 56 10
12 Miami Trace 8 2 58 51 7
13 Warren 7 2 69 46 23
14 Westfall 7 2 62 51 12
15 Meigs 7 2 56 46 10
16 Northwest 6 2 57 43 15
17 Notre Dame 3 1 50 44 6
18 Trimble 5 2 65 51 14
19 Sheridan 5 2 56 43 13
20 South Point 5 2 61 57 4
21 Fairfield Union 6 3 57 45 12
22 Eastern Brown 6 3 57 47 10
23 Waverly 6 3 47 46 2
24 Nelsonville-York 7 4 57 51 6
25 Jackson 7 4 56 52 5
26 Chesapeake 5 3 65 42 23
27 North Adams 5 3 63 46 18
28 Fairland 5 3 63 53 10
29 Circleville 5 3 55 50 5
30 South Gallia 5 3 60 57 3
31 Belpre 6 4 55 57 -2
32 Adena 5 4 54 47 7
33 Southeastern 5 4 50 45 5
34 Peebles 5 4 51 49 2
35 Federal Hocking 5 4 62 62 0
36 Manchester 6 5 54 52 2
37 Whiteoak 3 3 60 59 1
38 Zane Trace 3 3 49 49 0
39 Sciotoville 2 2 56 54 1
40 Unioto 4 5 55 50 5
41 Beaver Eastern 4 5 57 57 0
42 Chillicothe 4 5 52 54 -2
43 Lynchburg-Clay 4 5 48 56 -7
44 River Valley 4 5 45 54 -9
45 Piketon 3 4 53 55 -2
46 Portsmouth West 3 4 51 57 -6
47 Southern 3 5 44 55 -11
48 Miller 3 5 50 62 -12
49 Crooksville 3 5 46 60 -14
50 Valley 3 6 59 58 1
51 Waterford 3 6 50 51 -1
52 Rock Hill 3 6 48 53 -5
53 Western 3 6 60 67 -7
54 Logan Elm 3 6 42 50 -8
54 Oak Hill 3 6 43 52 -8
56 Symmes Valley 2 4 47 58 -12
57 Glenwood 2 4 45 60 -15
58 Wellston 2 6 55 60 -5
59 Huntington 2 6 40 49 -9
60 Gallia Academy 2 6 41 53 -1361 Ripley 2 7 43 52 -10
62 Athens 2 7 39 53 -14
63 St. Joseph 1 5 54 57 -2
64 Paint Valley 1 5 46 57 -11
65 Logan 1 5 32 53 -21
66 McClain 1 7 39 57 -18
67 West Union 1 8 43 67 -24
68 Clay 0 5 27 55 -28
69 Green 0 6 45 59 -14
70 Coal Grove 0 7 61 75 -14
71 Eastern Meigs 0 9 46 69 -23
72 Alexander 0 10 36 58 -22

[Hookshot]

It blows my mind that you have Marietta 3 spots below Warren. I know this is just a personal ranking and there's no real skin in this (thank god), but Marietta's win vs. Massillon Perry is better than any win Warren has, they have not lost any games, and they have both pretty equally dominated the common opponents. There is no data point that constitutes Warren being ranked above Marietta, much less multiple spots.

Marietta has played the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in all of division 2, including the easiest in the SE District. Perry has 2 wins and those teams they’ve beaten have a combined 2 wins. Bloom Carroll is a better win than Perry.

Marietta may be better, which I believe will be found out in about 10 days, but it isn’t egregious for them to be a couple of spots below Warren right now.

1. You don’t determine who the better team is playing one game.
2. Both Perry and Bethel (two of Marietta’s wins) would be among the top 10 or so teams in the Southeast right now if they played here.
3. Why do you know what you think you know about Perry and Bloom Carroll comparisons.
4. Are you factoring injuries, sicknesses, etc. into your or just adding up a teams wins and losses and opponent records?

Having said all of that, I don’t question Warren’s top ranking. I do question fans who think they have the state of Ohio’s strength of schedule rankings figured out 1/3 of the way into the season.

[waterboy99]

I should be caught up now, let me know if something is missing

SEO BASKETBALL STANDINGS 2023-24
Pos Team W L PF PA DIFF
1 Fairfield 9 0 60 40 20
2 Marietta 8 0 62 36 26
3 South Webster 8 0 69 47 21
4 New Lexington 9 1 55 41 14
5 Vinton County 7 1 64 41 23
6 Minford 7 1 65 47 18
7 Washington 7 1 61 47 13
8 Hillsboro 6 1 59 45 14
8 Wheelersburg 6 1 66 53 14
10 Ironton 6 1 71 58 13
11 Portsmouth 6 1 66 56 10
12 Miami Trace 8 2 58 51 7
13 Warren 7 2 69 46 23
14 Westfall 7 2 62 51 12
15 Meigs 7 2 56 46 10
16 Northwest 6 2 57 43 15
17 Notre Dame 3 1 50 44 6
18 Trimble 5 2 65 51 14
19 Sheridan 5 2 56 43 13
20 South Point 5 2 61 57 4
21 Fairfield Union 6 3 57 45 12
22 Eastern Brown 6 3 57 47 10
23 Waverly 6 3 47 46 2
24 Nelsonville-York 7 4 57 51 6
25 Jackson 7 4 56 52 5
26 Chesapeake 5 3 65 42 23
27 North Adams 5 3 63 46 18
28 Fairland 5 3 63 53 10
29 Circleville 5 3 55 50 5
30 South Gallia 5 3 60 57 3
31 Belpre 6 4 55 57 -2
32 Adena 5 4 54 47 7
33 Southeastern 5 4 50 45 5
34 Peebles 5 4 51 49 2
35 Federal Hocking 5 4 62 62 0
36 Manchester 6 5 54 52 2
37 Whiteoak 3 3 60 59 1
38 Zane Trace 3 3 49 49 0
39 Sciotoville 2 2 56 54 1
40 Unioto 4 5 55 50 5
41 Beaver Eastern 4 5 57 57 0
42 Chillicothe 4 5 52 54 -2
43 Lynchburg-Clay 4 5 48 56 -7
44 River Valley 4 5 45 54 -9
45 Piketon 3 4 53 55 -2
46 Portsmouth West 3 4 51 57 -6
47 Southern 3 5 44 55 -11
48 Miller 3 5 50 62 -12
49 Crooksville 3 5 46 60 -14
50 Valley 3 6 59 58 1
51 Waterford 3 6 50 51 -1
52 Rock Hill 3 6 48 53 -5
53 Western 3 6 60 67 -7
54 Logan Elm 3 6 42 50 -8
54 Oak Hill 3 6 43 52 -8
56 Symmes Valley 2 4 47 58 -12
57 Glenwood 2 4 45 60 -15
58 Wellston 2 6 55 60 -5
59 Huntington 2 6 40 49 -9
60 Gallia Academy 2 6 41 53 -1361 Ripley 2 7 43 52 -10
62 Athens 2 7 39 53 -14
63 St. Joseph 1 5 54 57 -2
64 Paint Valley 1 5 46 57 -11
65 Logan 1 5 32 53 -21
66 McClain 1 7 39 57 -18
67 West Union 1 8 43 67 -24
68 Clay 0 5 27 55 -28
69 Green 0 6 45 59 -14
70 Coal Grove 0 7 61 75 -14
71 Eastern Meigs 0 9 46 69 -23
72 Alexander 0 10 36 58 -22

According to the SHAC website, Manchester is 7-5 with wins over Portsmouth Clay, New Boston, Fayetteville, Ripley, Geen, Felicity, and West Union. Losses to Fairfield, Pendleton County, Eastern Brown, Whiteoak, and North Adams. It also has Lynchburg at 4-4 but I've noticed that sometimes scores are not put on the site for a few days sometimes.

[pfloyd]

It blows my mind that you have Marietta 3 spots below Warren. I know this is just a personal ranking and there's no real skin in this (thank god), but Marietta's win vs. Massillon Perry is better than any win Warren has, they have not lost any games, and they have both pretty equally dominated the common opponents. There is no data point that constitutes Warren being ranked above Marietta, much less multiple spots.

Marietta has played the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in all of division 2, including the easiest in the SE District. Perry has 2 wins and those teams they’ve beaten have a combined 2 wins. Bloom Carroll is a better win than Perry.

Marietta may be better, which I believe will be found out in about 10 days, but it isn’t egregious for them to be a couple of spots below Warren right now.

... you took the response right out of my fingers daniC! I had actually prepared to defend this weeks rankings midweek LAST WEEK LOL ... I went through the schedules & records for opponents "beaten and lost to for Marietta/Warren/Vinton County/Minford/South Point/South Webster wrote down all of the results so I could make a good comparison along with having seen ALL of these teams on the court through the first 4 weeks of the regular season ... beyond some peoples belief - Warren would not be #1 had they lost to Bloom Carroll this past Saturday just as they would not stay at #1 should they lose to any other team Below the Lancaster-Dixon Line ... they didn't! they stayed put at number one ... all of the other "players" looking to be recognized as THE #1 team are jockeying for position ... before the weekend play -as I did this prior to the weekend games - Marietta opponents were 11/34 (1 opponent with a winning record - Fed Hock 4-3 the Mass. Perry team you note was 2-6) ... Warren opponents 21/33 (3 opponents with winning records (Fed Hock 4-3/ Linsly 4-0/Belpre 6-3) ... Not enough evidence for me to drop Warren out of #1 ... as daniC pointed out Marietta goes to Warren next Friday the 12th - THAT game (should both Warren and Marietta win out going into that game) will determine if Warren drops out of the number one spot BUT it does not mean Marietta moves into #1 ... if South Webster wins vs Vinton Co/Wheelersburg/Minford the question would be "Do the Jeeps take over the 1 spot? or South Webster beats VC & the Burg and Minford beats South Webster, Do the Falcons go to #1? Wheelersburg? they just beat Porstmouth/if they beat Jackson tonight/South Webster Friday can they make claim to get close to #1 ... so many scenarios ... in my rankings teams work their way up to #1 ... Would the rankings look different IF I started/ held off ranking teams until after the 2023 portion of the season had been played? - Yes ... but I don't do it that way ... I rank first off of my preseason rankings, adjust from there ... teams move up and down based on those preseason rankings - I thought some teams would do better than they have - I was wrong about them (so far anyway) Unioto is a good example ... Eastern Pike another ... others have been better than I thought they would be - Fairfield Leesburg for example ... for consistency and trying to give the weekly rankings legitimacy I don't "just have teams make giant leaps over other teams - especially when we are talking about teams 1-15 or 20 ... teams improve, teams have injuries, teams don't pan out , or I was simply wrong ... over time - the length of the season - TEAMS GET TO / PLAY THEMSELVES ON THE COURT to where they should be in the rankings ...

[Hookshot]

It blows my mind that you have Marietta 3 spots below Warren. I know this is just a personal ranking and there's no real skin in this (thank god), but Marietta's win vs. Massillon Perry is better than any win Warren has, they have not lost any games, and they have both pretty equally dominated the common opponents. There is no data point that constitutes Warren being ranked above Marietta, much less multiple spots.

Marietta has played the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in all of division 2, including the easiest in the SE District. Perry has 2 wins and those teams they’ve beaten have a combined 2 wins. Bloom Carroll is a better win than Perry.

Marietta may be better, which I believe will be found out in about 10 days, but it isn’t egregious for them to be a couple of spots below Warren right now.

... you took the response right out of my fingers daniC! I had actually prepared to defend this weeks rankings midweek LAST WEEK LOL ... I went through the schedules & records for opponents "beaten and lost to for Marietta/Warren/Vinton County/Minford/South Point/South Webster wrote down all of the results so I could make a good comparison along with having seen ALL of these teams on the court through the first 4 weeks of the regular season ... beyond some peoples belief - Warren would not be #1 had they lost to Bloom Carroll this past Saturday just as they would not stay at #1 should they lose to any other team Below the Lancaster-Dixon Line ... they didn't! they stayed put at number one ... all of the other "players" looking to be recognized as THE #1 team are jockeying for position ... before the weekend play -as I did this prior to the weekend games - Marietta opponents were 11/34 (1 opponent with a winning record - Fed Hock 4-3 the Mass. Perry team you note was 2-6) ... Warren opponents 21/33 (3 opponents with winning records (Fed Hock 4-3/ Linsly 4-0/Belpre 6-3) ... Not enough evidence for me to drop Warren out of #1 ... as daniC pointed out Marietta goes to Warren next Friday the 12th - THAT game (should both Warren and Marietta win out going into that game) will determine if Warren drops out of the number one spot BUT it does not mean Marietta moves into #1 ... if South Webster wins vs Vinton Co/Wheelersburg/Minford the question would be "Do the Jeeps take over the 1 spot? or South Webster beats VC & the Burg and Minford beats South Webster, Do the Falcons go to #1? Wheelersburg? they just beat Porstmouth/if they beat Jackson tonight/South Webster Friday can they make claim to get close to #1 ... so many scenarios ... in my rankings teams work their way up to #1 ... Would the rankings look different IF I started/ held off ranking teams until after the 2023 portion of the season had been played? - Yes ... but I don't do it that way ... I rank first off of my preseason rankings, adjust from there ... teams move up and down based on those preseason rankings - I thought some teams would do better than they have - I was wrong about them (so far anyway) Unioto is a good example ... Eastern Pike another ... others have been better than I thought they would be - Fairfield Leesburg for example ... for consistency and trying to give the weekly rankings legitimacy I don't "just have teams make giant leaps over other teams - especially when we are talking about teams 1-15 or 20 ... teams improve, teams have injuries, teams don't pan out , or I was simply wrong ... over time - the length of the season - TEAMS GET TO / PLAY THEMSELVES ON THE COURT to where they should be in the rankings ...

Pfloyd, no real arguments with any of that, but again records can be very deceiving -- Warren lost to an 0-5 team but that is a very solid ball club and had the best player on the floor when they played who was just really tough down the stretch (also Warren had foul trouble that hurt them abnormally that game). Marietta beat a team with just two wins but that team (Perry) I believe would be one of the best 5 teams in Southeast Ohio if they played here. Their losses are to teams with a record of 43-11, most of them D-1. Like I've said before, I do not disagree with your ranking with Warren at No. 1.

[boss8]

Marietta has played the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in all of division 2, including the easiest in the SE District. Perry has 2 wins and those teams they’ve beaten have a combined 2 wins. Bloom Carroll is a better win than Perry.

Marietta may be better, which I believe will be found out in about 10 days, but it isn’t egregious for them to be a couple of spots below Warren right now.

... you took the response right out of my fingers daniC! I had actually prepared to defend this weeks rankings midweek LAST WEEK LOL ... I went through the schedules & records for opponents "beaten and lost to for Marietta/Warren/Vinton County/Minford/South Point/South Webster wrote down all of the results so I could make a good comparison along with having seen ALL of these teams on the court through the first 4 weeks of the regular season ... beyond some peoples belief - Warren would not be #1 had they lost to Bloom Carroll this past Saturday just as they would not stay at #1 should they lose to any other team Below the Lancaster-Dixon Line ... they didn't! they stayed put at number one ... all of the other "players" looking to be recognized as THE #1 team are jockeying for position ... before the weekend play -as I did this prior to the weekend games - Marietta opponents were 11/34 (1 opponent with a winning record - Fed Hock 4-3 the Mass. Perry team you note was 2-6) ... Warren opponents 21/33 (3 opponents with winning records (Fed Hock 4-3/ Linsly 4-0/Belpre 6-3) ... Not enough evidence for me to drop Warren out of #1 ... as daniC pointed out Marietta goes to Warren next Friday the 12th - THAT game (should both Warren and Marietta win out going into that game) will determine if Warren drops out of the number one spot BUT it does not mean Marietta moves into #1 ... if South Webster wins vs Vinton Co/Wheelersburg/Minford the question would be "Do the Jeeps take over the 1 spot? or South Webster beats VC & the Burg and Minford beats South Webster, Do the Falcons go to #1? Wheelersburg? they just beat Porstmouth/if they beat Jackson tonight/South Webster Friday can they make claim to get close to #1 ... so many scenarios ... in my rankings teams work their way up to #1 ... Would the rankings look different IF I started/ held off ranking teams until after the 2023 portion of the season had been played? - Yes ... but I don't do it that way ... I rank first off of my preseason rankings, adjust from there ... teams move up and down based on those preseason rankings - I thought some teams would do better than they have - I was wrong about them (so far anyway) Unioto is a good example ... Eastern Pike another ... others have been better than I thought they would be - Fairfield Leesburg for example ... for consistency and trying to give the weekly rankings legitimacy I don't "just have teams make giant leaps over other teams - especially when we are talking about teams 1-15 or 20 ... teams improve, teams have injuries, teams don't pan out , or I was simply wrong ... over time - the length of the season - TEAMS GET TO / PLAY THEMSELVES ON THE COURT to where they should be in the rankings ...

Pfloyd, no real arguments with any of that, but again records can be very deceiving -- Warren lost to an 0-5 team but that is a very solid ball club and had the best player on the floor when they played who was just really tough down the stretch (also Warren had foul trouble that hurt them abnormally that game). Marietta beat a team with just two wins but that team (Perry) I believe would be one of the best 5 teams in Southeast Ohio if they played here. Their losses are to teams with a record of 43-11, most of them D-1. Like I've said before, I do not disagree with your ranking with Warren at No. 1.

Exactly my point. You keep saying records don’t tell the whole story, but dismiss Marietta’s win vs Perry because their record is bad. Anyone who watched that game would know that Perry is a solid team, better than most teams in this area…which is why they scheduled the game.

Also, I don’t think Warren is penalized enough for losing to PHS. They are not the PHS of old, they do not have the talent they normally do. They lost to a Williamstown team that is solid but single A and not as talented as they have been in the past.

I think Warren is solid but still just don’t see the reasoning for keeping them #1. But that’s why they play the games. Should be big time matchups. Kendall dominated Taylor in Sutton last year, and he’s come back an even more improved player. Looking forward to it.

[mattash]

I should be caught up now, let me know if something is missing

SEO BASKETBALL STANDINGS 2023-24
Pos Team W L PF PA DIFF
1 Fairfield 9 0 60 40 20
2 Marietta 8 0 62 36 26
3 South Webster 8 0 69 47 21
4 New Lexington 9 1 55 41 14
5 Vinton County 7 1 64 41 23
6 Minford 7 1 65 47 18
7 Washington 7 1 61 47 13
8 Hillsboro 6 1 59 45 14
8 Wheelersburg 6 1 66 53 14
10 Ironton 6 1 71 58 13
11 Portsmouth 6 1 66 56 10
12 Miami Trace 8 2 58 51 7
13 Warren 7 2 69 46 23
14 Westfall 7 2 62 51 12
15 Meigs 7 2 56 46 10
16 Northwest 6 2 57 43 15
17 Notre Dame 3 1 50 44 6
18 Trimble 5 2 65 51 14
19 Sheridan 5 2 56 43 13
20 South Point 5 2 61 57 4
21 Fairfield Union 6 3 57 45 12
22 Eastern Brown 6 3 57 47 10
23 Waverly 6 3 47 46 2
24 Nelsonville-York 7 4 57 51 6
25 Jackson 7 4 56 52 5
26 Chesapeake 5 3 65 42 23
27 North Adams 5 3 63 46 18
28 Fairland 5 3 63 53 10
29 Circleville 5 3 55 50 5
30 South Gallia 5 3 60 57 3
31 Belpre 6 4 55 57 -2
32 Adena 5 4 54 47 7
33 Southeastern 5 4 50 45 5
34 Peebles 5 4 51 49 2
35 Federal Hocking 5 4 62 62 0
36 Manchester 6 5 54 52 2
37 Whiteoak 3 3 60 59 1
38 Zane Trace 3 3 49 49 0
39 Sciotoville 2 2 56 54 1
40 Unioto 4 5 55 50 5
41 Beaver Eastern 4 5 57 57 0
42 Chillicothe 4 5 52 54 -2
43 Lynchburg-Clay 4 5 48 56 -7
44 River Valley 4 5 45 54 -9
45 Piketon 3 4 53 55 -2
46 Portsmouth West 3 4 51 57 -6
47 Southern 3 5 44 55 -11
48 Miller 3 5 50 62 -12
49 Crooksville 3 5 46 60 -14
50 Valley 3 6 59 58 1
51 Waterford 3 6 50 51 -1
52 Rock Hill 3 6 48 53 -5
53 Western 3 6 60 67 -7
54 Logan Elm 3 6 42 50 -8
54 Oak Hill 3 6 43 52 -8
56 Symmes Valley 2 4 47 58 -12
57 Glenwood 2 4 45 60 -15
58 Wellston 2 6 55 60 -5
59 Huntington 2 6 40 49 -9
60 Gallia Academy 2 6 41 53 -1361 Ripley 2 7 43 52 -10
62 Athens 2 7 39 53 -14
63 St. Joseph 1 5 54 57 -2
64 Paint Valley 1 5 46 57 -11
65 Logan 1 5 32 53 -21
66 McClain 1 7 39 57 -18
67 West Union 1 8 43 67 -24
68 Clay 0 5 27 55 -28
69 Green 0 6 45 59 -14
70 Coal Grove 0 7 61 75 -14
71 Eastern Meigs 0 9 46 69 -23
72 Alexander 0 10 36 58 -22

According to the SHAC website, Manchester is 7-5 with wins over Portsmouth Clay, New Boston, Fayetteville, Ripley, Geen, Felicity, and West Union. Losses to Fairfield, Pendleton County, Eastern Brown, Whiteoak, and North Adams. It also has Lynchburg at 4-4 but I've noticed that sometimes scores are not put on the site for a few days sometimes.

https://seohiopreps.com/basketball/team/manchester/ what i have

[pfloyd]

Marietta has played the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in all of division 2, including the easiest in the SE District. Perry has 2 wins and those teams they’ve beaten have a combined 2 wins. Bloom Carroll is a better win than Perry.

Marietta may be better, which I believe will be found out in about 10 days, but it isn’t egregious for them to be a couple of spots below Warren right now.

... you took the response right out of my fingers daniC! I had actually prepared to defend this weeks rankings midweek LAST WEEK LOL ... I went through the schedules & records for opponents "beaten and lost to for Marietta/Warren/Vinton County/Minford/South Point/South Webster wrote down all of the results so I could make a good comparison along with having seen ALL of these teams on the court through the first 4 weeks of the regular season ... beyond some peoples belief - Warren would not be #1 had they lost to Bloom Carroll this past Saturday just as they would not stay at #1 should they lose to any other team Below the Lancaster-Dixon Line ... they didn't! they stayed put at number one ... all of the other "players" looking to be recognized as THE #1 team are jockeying for position ... before the weekend play -as I did this prior to the weekend games - Marietta opponents were 11/34 (1 opponent with a winning record - Fed Hock 4-3 the Mass. Perry team you note was 2-6) ... Warren opponents 21/33 (3 opponents with winning records (Fed Hock 4-3/ Linsly 4-0/Belpre 6-3) ... Not enough evidence for me to drop Warren out of #1 ... as daniC pointed out Marietta goes to Warren next Friday the 12th - THAT game (should both Warren and Marietta win out going into that game) will determine if Warren drops out of the number one spot BUT it does not mean Marietta moves into #1 ... if South Webster wins vs Vinton Co/Wheelersburg/Minford the question would be "Do the Jeeps take over the 1 spot? or South Webster beats VC & the Burg and Minford beats South Webster, Do the Falcons go to #1? Wheelersburg? they just beat Porstmouth/if they beat Jackson tonight/South Webster Friday can they make claim to get close to #1 ... so many scenarios ... in my rankings teams work their way up to #1 ... Would the rankings look different IF I started/ held off ranking teams until after the 2023 portion of the season had been played? - Yes ... but I don't do it that way ... I rank first off of my preseason rankings, adjust from there ... teams move up and down based on those preseason rankings - I thought some teams would do better than they have - I was wrong about them (so far anyway) Unioto is a good example ... Eastern Pike another ... others have been better than I thought they would be - Fairfield Leesburg for example ... for consistency and trying to give the weekly rankings legitimacy I don't "just have teams make giant leaps over other teams - especially when we are talking about teams 1-15 or 20 ... teams improve, teams have injuries, teams don't pan out , or I was simply wrong ... over time - the length of the season - TEAMS GET TO / PLAY THEMSELVES ON THE COURT to where they should be in the rankings ...

Pfloyd, no real arguments with any of that, but again records can be very deceiving -- Warren lost to an 0-5 team but that is a very solid ball club and had the best player on the floor when they played who was just really tough down the stretch (also Warren had foul trouble that hurt them abnormally that game). Marietta beat a team with just two wins but that team (Perry) I believe would be one of the best 5 teams in Southeast Ohio if they played here. Their losses are to teams with a record of 43-11, most of them D-1. Like I've said before, I do not disagree with your ranking with Warren at No. 1.

... Hookshot, the hardest time of the year to do the rankings is in the first 3-4 weeks - the River teams of the OVC play non-conference games vs the foreign teams in KY and WVa ... the teams on the fringes of the SE District - any side - play teams they have some type of connection with ie. Marietta playing Mass.Perry & others , Warren playing Linsly, Cambridge, Caldwells etc. the teams West of Rte 23 play teams closer to Cincinnati than Athens ... it is hard enough to keep up with the 72 teams IN the SE District LOL ... throw in that we used to be able to read about teams all over - go to their local newspaper online read about the games - get to be familiar with names of players, teams etc. now at best newspapers let you read a few articles then to keep reading you have to buy an online subscription ... you're right records don't tell you about the opponents - I keep peeling away the records by looking at the opponents "opponents" etc. it takes time ... my rankings AREN'T "official" anything LOL ... just as my Napkin Stats are "official , UN-official" stats for games I go see ... the rankings are to START discussions NOT be an "end all" ... if they were "exact, end all" - this would be a boring website - it would be one guy TELLING everyone - THIS IS IT ... I usually don't agree with anyone's rankings of the SE district ie. AP polls, MaxPrep etc. as I believe the "eye test" has to be part of ranking teams - I believe if you do it right you have to know the products you are going to rank ... to compare there has to be knowledge of all the "products" you are comparing ... I'm an old guy, closing in on 70, I've been watching high school basketball in earnest in the SE District, all divisions for 24+ years ... I have MY idea what "good high school" basketball is or isn't ... right or wrong , I for 20+ years, have decided that I'm okay with having people disagree with me ... I'm don't have a problem being wrong or more - being proven wrong ... but it doesn't mean I LIKE being wrong - so to make sure that I do it right - I go see the games, I travel the district from North Adams to Marietta to the Northwest Territories of Miami Trace/Wash CH/Circleville to the river - Fairland/Portsmouth etc. and gyms between to watch "good teams" play good games vs good opponents" ... told Mrs. Pfloyd my "tour schedule" before the Christmas break started - told her I was heading to Shawnee State, the Ironton Classic, the Warren Clash, the Spartan Classic and games on the week days ... she said "of course you are ... you can't do things half a$$ ... you have to be the best" - told her I don't know any other way ... bottomline- I do the rankings as fairly, unbiased as possible ... and still I agree to disagree with anyone who "see's things another way" ... as I92 would say "things play out on the court in the end" ... one win one loss doesn't make a team great or horrible - it's one game ... the story is told over the course of the season on the court ...

[522Pirate]

It blows my mind that you have Marietta 3 spots below Warren. I know this is just a personal ranking and there's no real skin in this (thank god), but Marietta's win vs. Massillon Perry is better than any win Warren has, they have not lost any games, and they have both pretty equally dominated the common opponents. There is no data point that constitutes Warren being ranked above Marietta, much less multiple spots.

Marietta has played the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in all of division 2, including the easiest in the SE District. Perry has 2 wins and those teams they’ve beaten have a combined 2 wins. Bloom Carroll is a better win than Perry.

Marietta may be better, which I believe will be found out in about 10 days, but it isn’t egregious for them to be a couple of spots below Warren right now.

... you took the response right out of my fingers daniC! I had actually prepared to defend this weeks rankings midweek LAST WEEK LOL ... I went through the schedules & records for opponents "beaten and lost to for Marietta/Warren/Vinton County/Minford/South Point/South Webster wrote down all of the results so I could make a good comparison along with having seen ALL of these teams on the court through the first 4 weeks of the regular season ... beyond some peoples belief - Warren would not be #1 had they lost to Bloom Carroll this past Saturday just as they would not stay at #1 should they lose to any other team Below the Lancaster-Dixon Line ... they didn't! they stayed put at number one ... all of the other "players" looking to be recognized as THE #1 team are jockeying for position ... before the weekend play -as I did this prior to the weekend games - Marietta opponents were 11/34 (1 opponent with a winning record - Fed Hock 4-3 the Mass. Perry team you note was 2-6) ... Warren opponents 21/33 (3 opponents with winning records (Fed Hock 4-3/ Linsly 4-0/Belpre 6-3) ... Not enough evidence for me to drop Warren out of #1 ... as daniC pointed out Marietta goes to Warren next Friday the 12th - THAT game (should both Warren and Marietta win out going into that game) will determine if Warren drops out of the number one spot BUT it does not mean Marietta moves into #1 ... if South Webster wins vs Vinton Co/Wheelersburg/Minford the question would be "Do the Jeeps take over the 1 spot? or South Webster beats VC & the Burg and Minford beats South Webster, Do the Falcons go to #1? Wheelersburg? they just beat Porstmouth/if they beat Jackson tonight/South Webster Friday can they make claim to get close to #1 ... so many scenarios ... in my rankings teams work their way up to #1 ... Would the rankings look different IF I started/ held off ranking teams until after the 2023 portion of the season had been played? - Yes ... but I don't do it that way ... I rank first off of my preseason rankings, adjust from there ... teams move up and down based on those preseason rankings - I thought some teams would do better than they have - I was wrong about them (so far anyway) Unioto is a good example ... Eastern Pike another ... others have been better than I thought they would be - Fairfield Leesburg for example ... for consistency and trying to give the weekly rankings legitimacy I don't "just have teams make giant leaps over other teams - especially when we are talking about teams 1-15 or 20 ... teams improve, teams have injuries, teams don't pan out , or I was simply wrong ... over time - the length of the season - TEAMS GET TO / PLAY THEMSELVES ON THE COURT to where they should be in the rankings ...

Keep doing what you’re doing…like the college football AP/coaches polls…it serves the intended purpose…starting and sustaining interest, i.e. conversations, all season long!

[peake71]

Pfloyd you do an amazing job ranking all these schools. The time, the miles you have put on in those years. I am 70 and the body does get tired.
You and have one thing in common is we love high school basketball. I travel for the Peake games and have gone to some of the holiday tournaments in the past. I bleed purple, why else would I drive an hour a half to watch the Peake just blow a team out. I have driven to Cincinnati, Newark and Toronto just to watch my team play. I watched summer ball at Marshall. My riding companion and I traveled to Green and Manchester just for scrimmages this year. I like to support the kids.
That gives me enjoyment.
I should see you at North Adams on the 13th or for the Dave Young Classic.

[Hookshot]

... you took the response right out of my fingers daniC! I had actually prepared to defend this weeks rankings midweek LAST WEEK LOL ... I went through the schedules & records for opponents "beaten and lost to for Marietta/Warren/Vinton County/Minford/South Point/South Webster wrote down all of the results so I could make a good comparison along with having seen ALL of these teams on the court through the first 4 weeks of the regular season ... beyond some peoples belief - Warren would not be #1 had they lost to Bloom Carroll this past Saturday just as they would not stay at #1 should they lose to any other team Below the Lancaster-Dixon Line ... they didn't! they stayed put at number one ... all of the other "players" looking to be recognized as THE #1 team are jockeying for position ... before the weekend play -as I did this prior to the weekend games - Marietta opponents were 11/34 (1 opponent with a winning record - Fed Hock 4-3 the Mass. Perry team you note was 2-6) ... Warren opponents 21/33 (3 opponents with winning records (Fed Hock 4-3/ Linsly 4-0/Belpre 6-3) ... Not enough evidence for me to drop Warren out of #1 ... as daniC pointed out Marietta goes to Warren next Friday the 12th - THAT game (should both Warren and Marietta win out going into that game) will determine if Warren drops out of the number one spot BUT it does not mean Marietta moves into #1 ... if South Webster wins vs Vinton Co/Wheelersburg/Minford the question would be "Do the Jeeps take over the 1 spot? or South Webster beats VC & the Burg and Minford beats South Webster, Do the Falcons go to #1? Wheelersburg? they just beat Porstmouth/if they beat Jackson tonight/South Webster Friday can they make claim to get close to #1 ... so many scenarios ... in my rankings teams work their way up to #1 ... Would the rankings look different IF I started/ held off ranking teams until after the 2023 portion of the season had been played? - Yes ... but I don't do it that way ... I rank first off of my preseason rankings, adjust from there ... teams move up and down based on those preseason rankings - I thought some teams would do better than they have - I was wrong about them (so far anyway) Unioto is a good example ... Eastern Pike another ... others have been better than I thought they would be - Fairfield Leesburg for example ... for consistency and trying to give the weekly rankings legitimacy I don't "just have teams make giant leaps over other teams - especially when we are talking about teams 1-15 or 20 ... teams improve, teams have injuries, teams don't pan out , or I was simply wrong ... over time - the length of the season - TEAMS GET TO / PLAY THEMSELVES ON THE COURT to where they should be in the rankings ...

Pfloyd, no real arguments with any of that, but again records can be very deceiving -- Warren lost to an 0-5 team but that is a very solid ball club and had the best player on the floor when they played who was just really tough down the stretch (also Warren had foul trouble that hurt them abnormally that game). Marietta beat a team with just two wins but that team (Perry) I believe would be one of the best 5 teams in Southeast Ohio if they played here. Their losses are to teams with a record of 43-11, most of them D-1. Like I've said before, I do not disagree with your ranking with Warren at No. 1.

... Hookshot, the hardest time of the year to do the rankings is in the first 3-4 weeks - the River teams of the OVC play non-conference games vs the foreign teams in KY and WVa ... the teams on the fringes of the SE District - any side - play teams they have some type of connection with ie. Marietta playing Mass.Perry & others , Warren playing Linsly, Cambridge, Caldwells etc. the teams West of Rte 23 play teams closer to Cincinnati than Athens ... it is hard enough to keep up with the 72 teams IN the SE District LOL ... throw in that we used to be able to read about teams all over - go to their local newspaper online read about the games - get to be familiar with names of players, teams etc. now at best newspapers let you read a few articles then to keep reading you have to buy an online subscription ... you're right records don't tell you about the opponents - I keep peeling away the records by looking at the opponents "opponents" etc. it takes time ... my rankings AREN'T "official" anything LOL ... just as my Napkin Stats are "official , UN-official" stats for games I go see ... the rankings are to START discussions NOT be an "end all" ... if they were "exact, end all" - this would be a boring website - it would be one guy TELLING everyone - THIS IS IT ... I usually don't agree with anyone's rankings of the SE district ie. AP polls, MaxPrep etc. as I believe the "eye test" has to be part of ranking teams - I believe if you do it right you have to know the products you are going to rank ... to compare there has to be knowledge of all the "products" you are comparing ... I'm an old guy, closing in on 70, I've been watching high school basketball in earnest in the SE District, all divisions for 24+ years ... I have MY idea what "good high school" basketball is or isn't ... right or wrong , I for 20+ years, have decided that I'm okay with having people disagree with me ... I'm don't have a problem being wrong or more - being proven wrong ... but it doesn't mean I LIKE being wrong - so to make sure that I do it right - I go see the games, I travel the district from North Adams to Marietta to the Northwest Territories of Miami Trace/Wash CH/Circleville to the river - Fairland/Portsmouth etc. and gyms between to watch "good teams" play good games vs good opponents" ... told Mrs. Pfloyd my "tour schedule" before the Christmas break started - told her I was heading to Shawnee State, the Ironton Classic, the Warren Clash, the Spartan Classic and games on the week days ... she said "of course you are ... you can't do things half a$$ ... you have to be the best" - told her I don't know any other way ... bottomline- I do the rankings as fairly, unbiased as possible ... and still I agree to disagree with anyone who "see's things another way" ... as I92 would say "things play out on the court in the end" ... one win one loss doesn't make a team great or horrible - it's one game ... the story is told over the course of the season on the court ...

Pfloyd, your response almost seems to indicate you think I was disagreeing with you. Not the case.

[waterboy99]

I should be caught up now, let me know if something is missing

SEO BASKETBALL STANDINGS 2023-24
Pos Team W L PF PA DIFF
1 Fairfield 9 0 60 40 20
2 Marietta 8 0 62 36 26
3 South Webster 8 0 69 47 21
4 New Lexington 9 1 55 41 14
5 Vinton County 7 1 64 41 23
6 Minford 7 1 65 47 18
7 Washington 7 1 61 47 13
8 Hillsboro 6 1 59 45 14
8 Wheelersburg 6 1 66 53 14
10 Ironton 6 1 71 58 13
11 Portsmouth 6 1 66 56 10
12 Miami Trace 8 2 58 51 7
13 Warren 7 2 69 46 23
14 Westfall 7 2 62 51 12
15 Meigs 7 2 56 46 10
16 Northwest 6 2 57 43 15
17 Notre Dame 3 1 50 44 6
18 Trimble 5 2 65 51 14
19 Sheridan 5 2 56 43 13
20 South Point 5 2 61 57 4
21 Fairfield Union 6 3 57 45 12
22 Eastern Brown 6 3 57 47 10
23 Waverly 6 3 47 46 2
24 Nelsonville-York 7 4 57 51 6
25 Jackson 7 4 56 52 5
26 Chesapeake 5 3 65 42 23
27 North Adams 5 3 63 46 18
28 Fairland 5 3 63 53 10
29 Circleville 5 3 55 50 5
30 South Gallia 5 3 60 57 3
31 Belpre 6 4 55 57 -2
32 Adena 5 4 54 47 7
33 Southeastern 5 4 50 45 5
34 Peebles 5 4 51 49 2
35 Federal Hocking 5 4 62 62 0
36 Manchester 6 5 54 52 2
37 Whiteoak 3 3 60 59 1
38 Zane Trace 3 3 49 49 0
39 Sciotoville 2 2 56 54 1
40 Unioto 4 5 55 50 5
41 Beaver Eastern 4 5 57 57 0
42 Chillicothe 4 5 52 54 -2
43 Lynchburg-Clay 4 5 48 56 -7
44 River Valley 4 5 45 54 -9
45 Piketon 3 4 53 55 -2
46 Portsmouth West 3 4 51 57 -6
47 Southern 3 5 44 55 -11
48 Miller 3 5 50 62 -12
49 Crooksville 3 5 46 60 -14
50 Valley 3 6 59 58 1
51 Waterford 3 6 50 51 -1
52 Rock Hill 3 6 48 53 -5
53 Western 3 6 60 67 -7
54 Logan Elm 3 6 42 50 -8
54 Oak Hill 3 6 43 52 -8
56 Symmes Valley 2 4 47 58 -12
57 Glenwood 2 4 45 60 -15
58 Wellston 2 6 55 60 -5
59 Huntington 2 6 40 49 -9
60 Gallia Academy 2 6 41 53 -1361 Ripley 2 7 43 52 -10
62 Athens 2 7 39 53 -14
63 St. Joseph 1 5 54 57 -2
64 Paint Valley 1 5 46 57 -11
65 Logan 1 5 32 53 -21
66 McClain 1 7 39 57 -18
67 West Union 1 8 43 67 -24
68 Clay 0 5 27 55 -28
69 Green 0 6 45 59 -14
70 Coal Grove 0 7 61 75 -14
71 Eastern Meigs 0 9 46 69 -23
72 Alexander 0 10 36 58 -22

According to the SHAC website, Manchester is 7-5 with wins over Portsmouth Clay, New Boston, Fayetteville, Ripley, Geen, Felicity, and West Union. Losses to Fairfield, Pendleton County, Eastern Brown, Whiteoak, and North Adams. It also has Lynchburg at 4-4 but I've noticed that sometimes scores are not put on the site for a few days sometimes.

https://seohiopreps.com/basketball/team/manchester/ what i have

They beat West Union on 12/29 in the consolation game of the county classic. That’s the one missing.

[Happy2bhere]

Putting this score here since no game thread for today.

Hillsboro -47
Eastern Brown - 56
@ Eastern

[Hookshot]

Putting this score here since no game thread for today.

Hillsboro -47
Eastern Brown - 56
@ Eastern

Did you attend this game? Isn't this a significant upset? Hillsboro with only one loss (Miami Trace) going into this one. Interested in factors impacting this outcome.

[Happy2bhere]

Putting this score here since no game thread for today.

Hillsboro -47
Eastern Brown - 56
@ Eastern

Did you attend this game? Isn't this a significant upset? Hillsboro with only one loss (Miami Trace) going into this one. Interested in factors impacting this outcome.

No I didn't, got some info from both sides. One of Eastern better players didn't play from what I heard. They said that Eastern did a good job on Hillsboro two guards and forced them into several bad shots, especially in second half.

[WonderNova]

I was there! What made this game even more shocking was Eastern's double figures avg. Scorer Grady Barber was out with a foot/ ankle injury. It was a very entertaining game, but Eastern's rebounding and defense frustrated Hillsboro's high powered scoring offense.and quality bench minutes really swung the game to the Warriors.

[danicalifornia]

Circleville 46
Miami Trace 39

MT led 34-17 at the half

[GrumpyPundit]

Putting this score here since no game thread for today.

Hillsboro -47
Eastern Brown - 56
@ Eastern

Wow, didn’t see that one coming!

[VCTailgater]

Pfloyd, I enjoy getting on here every week throughout the season to see your rankings and game breakdowns. By you doing this it really keeps the season interesting. Much appreciated! Thanks.