SEOAL 2010

[ohbuckeye2]

I do have a question for Paladin. Why do you love to hate on Jackson so much?

there is no ironton in the league anymore.
i love these threads that go from 1 thing to another.

I would like to appologize 1987 Chieftains, the comment I made was intened for someone else.

[1987chieftains]

OHbuckeye1 i wasn't saying anything bad about i-town. so????? not sure how i ruffled your feathers.

[GAHS83]

02 -- no hate here, just pointing out reality and as I see it, a divergence in the league, where the rich are going to get richer thru tough schedules and the rest will fade. I see Jackson in the latter group. Itown has been badly over-rated by many, but they have elected to take their ball and go home since they can't win anymore. And, if fact, I merely use Jackson as the model for what afflicts SEO -- weak scheduling and stunting a program. But the problem pervades almost all of SEO. Unlike NWO, where similar demographics and same type school districts exist, they have shown what other areas of the state has known for decades -- you get better playing better people, not ducking competition. If the problem is the administration ( which I find hard to believe as most coaches have a say over who to schedule, I did), they are truly gutless. But let me repeat -- thats fine for me. Its to Logan's advantage that the status quo continue. Cheers !!

If you truly believe that tougher competition makes you better, shouldn't you be pulling for all the schools in the SEOAL to schedule tougher and become better because that will make Logan better? The status quo in this case isn't to Logan's advantage.

FWIW, I think you have a point about the scheduling.

[Paladin]

GAHS83......... no question it would make for a better league & help all to be better prepared for post-season if tougher schedules were played by all. But lets be candid -- this isn't some super secret...... coaches have known for decades that better competition makes for better players/teams. This is about CHEAP WINS and stacking the record. This is about most having no guts, padding a record and pulling the wool over local fans' eyes.

Logan can't control what other teams do, but a decision was made years ago to drop smaller division non-league games and go after bigger schools, both to make the Chiefs tougher in the league & improve the chances of winning the league AND to help make them better for post -season play. Logan could have a huge gate with Nelsonville, as they once had, get an easy win as the series shows but not much else. Logan coud play a quality New Lex team again and get some wins but its against smaller competition.

Everyone thinks Logan has a run of good athletes and in some cases thats true, but not all. But the team overall is better, not from better athletes in general but because the normal athletes are challenged and prepared by the bigger schools so that the League is easier play for them. I have watched Logan for decades and they have always have a good player here or there. He11, in many instances we had better athletes when I played there( I played college ball with another Logan player & played with one Logan player who started 3 years at LB for Ohio St. & played with another who started 3 years at QB for O.U. & several played at D-III colleges). The difference is the average players have gotten much better thru the better competition. I've seen better talent in earlier years but its wasn't challenged & therefore wasn't ready. The SEOAL will find it difficult to beat Logan, even when the talent drops at Logan, as it does from year to year, but you won't beat them as they are showing now that they are better prepared, better challenged even when the talent isn't as good because their level of play is better than better athletes from other teams who aren't used to a higher level of competition. Numbers have nothing to do with what is happening now in the SEOAL. Its better competition & better preparation than athletes. Thats why Itown is running off with their tail between their legs.

[Orange and Brown]

GAHS83......... no question it would make for a better league & help all to be better prepared for post-season if tougher schedules were played by all. But lets be candid -- this isn't some super secret...... coaches have known for decades that better competition makes for better players/teams. This is about CHEAP WINS and stacking the record. This is about most having no guts, padding a record and pulling the wool over local fans' eyes.

Logan can't control what other teams do, but a decisioin was made years ago to drop smaller division non-league games and go after bigger schools, both to make the Chiefs tougher in the league & improve the chances of winning the league AND to help make them better for post -season play. Logan could have a huge gate with Nelsonville, as they once had, get an easy win as the series shows but not much else. Logan coud play a quality New Lex team again and get some wins but its against smaller competition.

Everyone thinks Logan has a run of good athletes and in some cases thats true, but not all. But the team overall is better, not from better athletes in general but because the normal athletes are challenged and prepared by the bigger schools so that the League is easier play for them. I have watched Logan for decades and they have always have a good player here or there. The difference is the average players have gotten much better thru the better competition. I've seen better talent in earlier years but its wasn't challenged & therefore wasn't ready. The SEOAL will find it difficult to beat Logan, even when the talent drops at Logan, as it does from year to year, but you won't beat them as they are showing now that they are better prepared, better challenged even when the talent isn't as good because their level of play is better than better athletes from other teams who aren't used to a higher level of competition. Numbers have nothing to do with what is happening now in the SEOAL. Its better competition & better preparation than athletes. Thats why Itown is running off with their tail between their legs.

This is hard to do, but here I go!










GOOD POST PALADIN!!!!!

[Paladin]

Some may recall several years ago as Logan was into the "new" non-league schedule of bigger schools and it wasn't going so well -- Logan finished 5-5 on the season, but WON the SEOAL.

Some may also recall all the hulabalu over Itown coming into the SEOAL again and the expectant string of titles they would win. Hello ? They won NONE as Logan was better prepared & challenged.

Some may recall that Zanesville, a very decent bigger division team was also added to the SEOAL -- Logan dominated them.

Some think this past season Logan had a team full of talented players -- they did but not heavy of college material. The QB is going to YSU, the center will probably play for Otterbein and a WR may play for someone, but the rest are just kids playing H.S. ball who got better than the rest of the teams they played by being challenged & prepped from playing bigger schools. I've seen better Logan kids than them, but none who were as successful. Reason ?? The team overall was better, not because they had better athletes. BETTER TEAM !!

That was from being better challenged & better prepared by bigger, tougher teams.

[Trojan_FB_Alum]

Going off of purely divisional figures Jackson actually plays a schedule that is more in line to their division then Logan. Jackson opponents have an average division of 3.00. Jackson is a D3 schools so it would appear that they have a fine schedule.

Logan a D2 has an average of 2.2 , for a deviation of 2 tenths below their division. Still nothing wrong with this schedule, but you can’t act like yours is some much better when it isn’t.

While Portsmouth a D4 has an average of 3.0, for a full division above their own. Then consider the quality of the D4 and D5 schools on Portsmouth’s schedule ( Burg, West, and Ironton), there is your example of scheduling up. This is a part of why the Trojans have been able to have a 7-5 playoff record since 2000, a regional title and, 2 regional runners up. It has also caused us to have some very down years posting very few wins.
Jackson doesn’t want to take that approach so be it, let them play who they want to play, it isn’t as if they are playing SOC1 schools. They still have a better average of division then Logan, in regards to their individual divisions.
People from Logan don’t seem to realize that most of the league considers it very tough, and uses the league games to prepare for the post season.

[Paladin]

Once again, Logan can't control where the league has gone in declining student population. Teams that are now lower in divisions than Logan is beyond our control. We can only control non-league games and there we are playing 3 D-I schools next year. I would share your outlook but for the league -- it is not tough. While the Trojans have played up , most others haven't. And to suggest that Jackson has played "tough" teams in their divison for non-league games is laughable !!

It is what it is. Those who play up and tougher teams get better. Those who duck competition have nothing to show for it. It is what it is.

[ohbuckeye2]

OHbuckeye1 i wasn't saying anything bad about i-town. so????? not sure how i ruffled your feathers.

I would like to appologize 1987 Chieftains for what I said, the comment I made was intened for someone else.

[Trojan_FB_Alum]

Once again, Logan can't control where the league has gone in declining student population. Teams that are now lower in divisions than Logan is beyond our control. We can only control non-league games and there we are playing 3 D-I schools next year. I would share your outlook but for the league -- it is not tough. While the Trojans have played up , most others haven't. And to suggest that Jackson has played "tough" teams in their divison for non-league games is laughable !!

It is what it is. Those who play up and tougher teams get better. Those who duck competition have nothing to show for it. It is what it is.

Just as Logan can't control the way the league has gone neither can Jackson. With the departure of 2 D2 schools from the league and only one D4 departing it has lowered the Ironmen’s divisor as well.
I am willing to concede that Wellston and Vinton County are not are not very challenging games for the Ironmen, however Wellston is a longstanding rivalry. Waverly however is a very good game most years, and puts out many good teams. The Ironmen’s other non league game is against Ironton, and although I know it pains Logan to say so we all know the Fighting Tigers are the premier program in Southeastern Ohio.

Logan does play 3 D1 schools but only Lancaster is a quality opponent most years. Their other non league game is against Zanesville; the Blue Devils normally have plenty of talent but haven't had much success when it comes to the post season.

To me that seems like two quality non league games apiece, most years. Sure there will be years when Pick North or Wellston have a good season, but on average I would say that 2 good games are about it.

[Paladin]

When you mention the tiggers, you should say ........ "used to be the premier program." Now it is Logan and has been for years. In terms of competition, you are wrong. Pick North would have wiped the field with most any one in SEO and most years would beat nearly all teams in SEO. Lancaster & ZHS are head & shoulders better than most of SEO. Only Hammy was a dog, even with a former DeSales coach there. They will get dropped for Reynoldsburg, who may not be an OCC power, but again would wipe the field with most in SEO . The question is.... would Logan do better playing other competition in SEO or the OCC teams ?? Thats a no-brainer.

[1987chieftains]

IMO we're all right and saying somewhat of the samething. but, w/o a large metro population in SEO for programs to pull from. SEO will be SEO. IMO as a whole the region is very slowly making head way. some programs are awaking to the rest of the state and others are still asleep at the wheel. i don't think you need to pack your schedule with top shelve teams. but, 1 or 2 big or better teams outside of 50 miles from your schools isn't going to hurt. ontop of which if they beat/pull an upset that team help the rest of the teams on they're schedule.

[ohbuckeye2]

How many State Champions, State Runners Up or Regional Champions have come out of the SEOAL in it's History??????

[1987chieftains]

outside of you guys and ptown???? zippo! sad!

[chieftainpride06]

How many State Champions, State Runners Up or Regional Champions have come out of the SEOAL in it's History??????

When Katie Smith played at logan they went to the state championship game 2 times, and both times they lost to pickerington. That was girls basketball though.

[Daniel Larusso]

I don't really see a problem with Jackson's non league schedule for next year. They have the games with Wellston and Vinton County for financial reasons. Then they have the challenging games with Waverly and Ironton. After that if they were to do well in the SEOAL versus the likes of Portsmouth, Gallipolis, Logan, Chillicothe, Warren, and Marietta. They should be about as prepared as possible for the playoff juggernauts from the big cities. Key words being as prepared as possible.

[1987chieftains]

I don't really see a problem with Jackson's non league schedule for next year. They have the games with Wellston and Vinton County for financial reasons. Then they have the challenging games with Waverly and Ironton. After that if they were to do well in the SEOAL versus the likes of Portsmouth, Gallipolis, Logan, Chillicothe, Warren, and Marietta. They should be about as prepared as possible for the playoff juggernauts from the big cities. Key words being as prepared as possible.

not with vc and wellston. a 1st run, 2nd, 3rd run, and 4th pass offence. your not going to get anywhere. never mind.

[Trojan_FB_Alum]

Logan fans, I think the one thing that is lacking from you perspectives is that ever other school in the SEOAL has to play a D2 school 37-3 in the last 4 years. Take it as a compliment if teams don’t want to add a power house team to their schedule knowing that it may result in a loss, when they know that they already have a game against Logan that will take everything they have. The SEOAL has obviously been more challenging for the rest of the league then it has been for Logan. If your team is struggling to or just barley competing in league why would you want to add other very tough games they will more than likely result in a loss?
If you think Logan’s schedule is tough just be happy that your program is in a place where you can go and compete against these schools, and let schools whose programs may not be at that level worry about their own schedule. Jackson going out and scheduling a team and getting their brains beat in will not make them any better. Trust me do to the schedule that Portsmouth has played though the years we have been on both ends of those beatings, and no good comes of it for the losing team.

[LetsGoPSU]

Its just a forum to promote his program. The only team that has ever done anything right. Is Logan.

[GalliaGrad78]

Just a self-serving, tired, lonely, old man with nothing better to do.