Gallipolis has had a lot of talent over the years but in the last couple of years it seems to be thining out.
With Marietta leaving it looks like Chillicothe might be the big kid on the block as far as the girls go.
Starting after 2013 I look for Chillicothe, Gallipolis, Logan and Warren to keep trading championships in the girls
where would you send you child for track
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ironmen1987
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Re: where would you send you child for track
I wasn't even aware that I could attend any of those functions. I'm still learning about everything that is available out there so feel free to educate me on any opportunities !
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ironmen1987
- SE
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Re: where would you send you child for track
I would have to agree. I think the title will run through our northern schools with Gallia being the dark horse at least the next couple of yearsnoreply66 wrote:Gallipolis has had a lot of talent over the years but in the last couple of years it seems to be thining out.
With Marietta leaving it looks like Chillicothe might be the big kid on the block as far as the girls go.
Starting after 2013 I look for Chillicothe, Gallipolis, Logan and Warren to keep trading championships in the girls
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Flatulence
- Freshman Team
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- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:08 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
I will agree with jump high about educating yourself. However, there are different philosophies concerning running and high school athletes. I am of the Arthur Lydiard camp of thought when it comes to distance running. It is my belief that we need to take it slow when developing runners at the high school level and my reason is simple _ I want the kids to enjoy running in their adult years. In my 38 years of coaching track and field and 22 years in cross country I have watched some VERY good high school runners who got no better in college. They had had their legs run off in high school with either beaucoup intervals or some ridiculous high mileage. On the other hand I have seen some high school runners who were average in high school and go on to college and have some fantastic years because their mileage was low in high school. Coaches are always asking themselves whether they are doing the correct thing when it comes to the "handling" of distance runners.
Seldom do we have a high school runner do more than 35 miles a week in training. Also, I believe in doing HARD intervals only once a week. Granted, we may not have outstanding distance runners in high school, BUT we have had many go on to college and do extremely well. And, here is my point, there are quite a few who continue to run on their own as adults. Matt Paxton was a very good high school runner and he put in what I called high mileage during his offseasons of about 65 miles a week. He still runs damned well for an "old man."
He took the time to use The Lydiard Method and build a great base. To build a great base it takes years of running every single day to reach the point of where the legs actually feel like they are ready to race and race hard.
In sprints, hurdles, and field events those are COMPLETELY different animals and the training there is much like training for basketball - short, fast - puke; short, fast - puke and continue repeating.
The anerobic system for sprints , hurdles, and field events is a system that has to be trained completely differently than does the aerobic system that is necessary for distance running. Jogging a mile for the anerobic system is LONG distance. A coach also has to consider the posture, the rhythm, the plumb line at the high velocity moment, the approach, the steps out of blocks, and the technique in the sprints, hurdles, and field events. The coaches have to develop drills that come as close to running an event as possible - for example in the 400 an aspect of the race needs to be trained on a daily basis.
There are a lot of considerations a coach needs to make when coaching track and field. In my opinion coaching track and field is the most difficult sport of all to coach. If you look at a team in track and field you see athletes in all shapes and sizes from so skinny they have to drink muddy water so you cannot see through them to your weight athletes. Some are short and some are very tall and NEVER can you judge a track athlete by his or her cover. That makes our sport interesting.
When deciding which course of action to take as a coach in distance you have The Lydiard Method of LSD - long, slow distance and fartlek to The Daniels Method. The Daniels Method is more or less about a controlled and planned program whereas Lydiard is based upon how the body feels for the day. Most of Lydiards speedwork is done on the roads or trails. When looking back on the bulk of his work and successes and watching the African athletes dominate distance running it makes one think he may be, still, a step ahead of many of the new coaches. Don't know, just my thoughts.
Good luck to everyone this season!
Seldom do we have a high school runner do more than 35 miles a week in training. Also, I believe in doing HARD intervals only once a week. Granted, we may not have outstanding distance runners in high school, BUT we have had many go on to college and do extremely well. And, here is my point, there are quite a few who continue to run on their own as adults. Matt Paxton was a very good high school runner and he put in what I called high mileage during his offseasons of about 65 miles a week. He still runs damned well for an "old man."
He took the time to use The Lydiard Method and build a great base. To build a great base it takes years of running every single day to reach the point of where the legs actually feel like they are ready to race and race hard.
In sprints, hurdles, and field events those are COMPLETELY different animals and the training there is much like training for basketball - short, fast - puke; short, fast - puke and continue repeating.
The anerobic system for sprints , hurdles, and field events is a system that has to be trained completely differently than does the aerobic system that is necessary for distance running. Jogging a mile for the anerobic system is LONG distance. A coach also has to consider the posture, the rhythm, the plumb line at the high velocity moment, the approach, the steps out of blocks, and the technique in the sprints, hurdles, and field events. The coaches have to develop drills that come as close to running an event as possible - for example in the 400 an aspect of the race needs to be trained on a daily basis.
There are a lot of considerations a coach needs to make when coaching track and field. In my opinion coaching track and field is the most difficult sport of all to coach. If you look at a team in track and field you see athletes in all shapes and sizes from so skinny they have to drink muddy water so you cannot see through them to your weight athletes. Some are short and some are very tall and NEVER can you judge a track athlete by his or her cover. That makes our sport interesting.
When deciding which course of action to take as a coach in distance you have The Lydiard Method of LSD - long, slow distance and fartlek to The Daniels Method. The Daniels Method is more or less about a controlled and planned program whereas Lydiard is based upon how the body feels for the day. Most of Lydiards speedwork is done on the roads or trails. When looking back on the bulk of his work and successes and watching the African athletes dominate distance running it makes one think he may be, still, a step ahead of many of the new coaches. Don't know, just my thoughts.
Good luck to everyone this season!
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ironmen1987
- SE
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Re: where would you send you child for track
So far I have just encouraged her to run and she does what she wants depending on the weather and how she feels. At most she runs 20 miles or so. I told her she needs to increase that as she moves up to high school but I haven't really set a goal for her yet.
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Rich Hoffman
- Waterboy
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- Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:25 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
[quote="Flatulence"]...There are a lot of considerations a coach needs to make when coaching track and field. In my opinion coaching track and field is the most difficult sport of all to coach... /quote]
Amen Coach, I agree completely, it amazes me with comments made by people who do not truly appreciate our sport and the intricacies. Each sport has them, but I hear people tell me all the time that our sport requires no time committment to coach and is so much easier to coach than other sports. People also denigrate our sports by saying they are not very popular - but in 2009, out of a then estimated 250 million people in the US, 47 million participated in some sort of distance race at the school or open level. Our sport is about more than spectating. That doesn't include participation in non-distance track & field events. In the last several world cross country championships, every country in the world has sent representatives to every event (I think there was an exception a few years ago when the worlds were held in Amman, Jordan and there were terrorism concerns). Cross country has done what no other event, not even the Olympics, and certainly no "professional" sports, or even governments have been able to do - bring people from every country despite differences in race, creed, political stance - together and out aside the differences and come together in the name of humanity and commonality to share goodwill and sportsmanship and friendship. No one got into a fight during the event, no one watching got stabbed, there wasn't any trash talking and name calling or 24 hours a day talking heads on ESPN, Nonetheless, it 60,000 people show up and watch the event in person, and it's broadcast across just about every country in Europe, Asia, and Canada...of course, here in North America, it isn't deemed newsworthy or watchable, but that's a whole other topic. Probably not enough blood, violence, and threat of future dementia from head trauma to endear it to our viewing public. Too many people can't appreciate the nuances, the concerted and focused continuous effort, the daily and weekly and yearly commitment it takes to enable one to run 4:30 pace for 7.5 miles over hill and dale. Although 47 million may appreciate it, the TV and media are dominated by the other 210 million who don't want to try and wrap their head around something that lasts more than 6 seconds without whistles and constant breaks to run (well, walk) to the kitchen to another sandwich or bag of chips.
There is a misconception that - and I have had Athletic Directors, at the college level, tell me to my face "Well, all you have to do is tell them to go run and then its just a matter of who wants to run the hardest." I've had people who coach one of the so-called "major sports" (their title, not mine) tell me that when they coached our sport(s) "there was no comparison in the time involved." My response is that that was their decision and choice, not the sports choice or the sports requirements. I no longer coach track, but back when I did collegiately, like all track coaches I had 60-70 athletes spread out across 16-18 events. Sure there was some physiological and neurological overlap in training for some events, some general biomotor skills common to most, but when you count in all the technical aspects and nuances of event, and the individual variations in anthropometrics, maturity, knowledge, and fitness of each student - if as a coach your goal is to help each student achieve their potential, then you must develop a plan or a variation of the master plan for each person. As a primarily distance coach at this time, even in cross country if I have 30 runners, then I have essentially 30 different training plans going. In track, the variations are even greater. It's just the way it needs and should be done. Unless all of the athletes are performing the same event and are idnetical clones, it's a necessity. The 5-8 140 pound freshman boy with poor hip extension and low aerobic endurance needs to be doing different things than the junior boy with good hip extension but less than adequate aerobic development. With technical events, the possibilities are almost endless. Compound that with the fact that in most track programs, if you have 1 assistant you are probably lucky, versus 5,6,8, or 10, and no support or presence of the athletic training staff to even fill coolers, and that places even more demands on the 1 or 2 coaches, and an even greater emphasis on matiruty and responsibility among the athletes. I salute the track coaches out there who continue to fight the good fight against significant misperceptions and understimates of what they are doing, who teach their students the sport, and the values of teamwork and commitment, not for the sake of winning the next event or game or meet, but for the sake of their long term holistic development and functioning as a student and later adult in our society.
Ok, I will stop sermonizing and get off my soap box for now. Sorry for the proselytizing .
Amen Coach, I agree completely, it amazes me with comments made by people who do not truly appreciate our sport and the intricacies. Each sport has them, but I hear people tell me all the time that our sport requires no time committment to coach and is so much easier to coach than other sports. People also denigrate our sports by saying they are not very popular - but in 2009, out of a then estimated 250 million people in the US, 47 million participated in some sort of distance race at the school or open level. Our sport is about more than spectating. That doesn't include participation in non-distance track & field events. In the last several world cross country championships, every country in the world has sent representatives to every event (I think there was an exception a few years ago when the worlds were held in Amman, Jordan and there were terrorism concerns). Cross country has done what no other event, not even the Olympics, and certainly no "professional" sports, or even governments have been able to do - bring people from every country despite differences in race, creed, political stance - together and out aside the differences and come together in the name of humanity and commonality to share goodwill and sportsmanship and friendship. No one got into a fight during the event, no one watching got stabbed, there wasn't any trash talking and name calling or 24 hours a day talking heads on ESPN, Nonetheless, it 60,000 people show up and watch the event in person, and it's broadcast across just about every country in Europe, Asia, and Canada...of course, here in North America, it isn't deemed newsworthy or watchable, but that's a whole other topic. Probably not enough blood, violence, and threat of future dementia from head trauma to endear it to our viewing public. Too many people can't appreciate the nuances, the concerted and focused continuous effort, the daily and weekly and yearly commitment it takes to enable one to run 4:30 pace for 7.5 miles over hill and dale. Although 47 million may appreciate it, the TV and media are dominated by the other 210 million who don't want to try and wrap their head around something that lasts more than 6 seconds without whistles and constant breaks to run (well, walk) to the kitchen to another sandwich or bag of chips.
There is a misconception that - and I have had Athletic Directors, at the college level, tell me to my face "Well, all you have to do is tell them to go run and then its just a matter of who wants to run the hardest." I've had people who coach one of the so-called "major sports" (their title, not mine) tell me that when they coached our sport(s) "there was no comparison in the time involved." My response is that that was their decision and choice, not the sports choice or the sports requirements. I no longer coach track, but back when I did collegiately, like all track coaches I had 60-70 athletes spread out across 16-18 events. Sure there was some physiological and neurological overlap in training for some events, some general biomotor skills common to most, but when you count in all the technical aspects and nuances of event, and the individual variations in anthropometrics, maturity, knowledge, and fitness of each student - if as a coach your goal is to help each student achieve their potential, then you must develop a plan or a variation of the master plan for each person. As a primarily distance coach at this time, even in cross country if I have 30 runners, then I have essentially 30 different training plans going. In track, the variations are even greater. It's just the way it needs and should be done. Unless all of the athletes are performing the same event and are idnetical clones, it's a necessity. The 5-8 140 pound freshman boy with poor hip extension and low aerobic endurance needs to be doing different things than the junior boy with good hip extension but less than adequate aerobic development. With technical events, the possibilities are almost endless. Compound that with the fact that in most track programs, if you have 1 assistant you are probably lucky, versus 5,6,8, or 10, and no support or presence of the athletic training staff to even fill coolers, and that places even more demands on the 1 or 2 coaches, and an even greater emphasis on matiruty and responsibility among the athletes. I salute the track coaches out there who continue to fight the good fight against significant misperceptions and understimates of what they are doing, who teach their students the sport, and the values of teamwork and commitment, not for the sake of winning the next event or game or meet, but for the sake of their long term holistic development and functioning as a student and later adult in our society.
Ok, I will stop sermonizing and get off my soap box for now. Sorry for the proselytizing .
Re: where would you send you child for track
There is no reason to get off of the soap box. To do track and cross country correctly and give the athletes the coaching that is needed to optimize their preformances takes time, knowledge and dedication. To put it back in footballs court, think about having an oline coach training the DB's. They may have some knowledge but it is a whole differant animal. As a track coach, it would be great to have a small group of athletes 8 to 1 ratio who all needed the same skill set to get better. It does not work that way in track.
Coaching is what you put into it and what you put into it is what you get out of it. The word "coach" has a special place in my heart, a coach is not the person with the whistle a real coach is the one with the knowledge and passion to to teach.
Coaching is what you put into it and what you put into it is what you get out of it. The word "coach" has a special place in my heart, a coach is not the person with the whistle a real coach is the one with the knowledge and passion to to teach.
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Flatulence
- Freshman Team
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- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:08 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
Hey, Jump High, in my wallet I have carried the following quote for years and reading your post i wanted to just jump and yell, "YES!" Here is the quote" "Leadership is not about a passion for power; rather, it is about a passion for knowledge."
I have NO idea who said it, but i read it and have carried it with me for years. It is good to hear someone else understanding just what leadership is all about.
I have NO idea who said it, but i read it and have carried it with me for years. It is good to hear someone else understanding just what leadership is all about.
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Rich Hoffman
- Waterboy
- Posts: 16
- Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:25 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
“A leader is not an administrator who loves to run others, but someone who carries water for his people so that they can get on with their jobsâ€
“If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.â€
"A leader is best when people barely know he exists, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: we did it ourselves."
“If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.â€
"A leader is best when people barely know he exists, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: we did it ourselves."
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Flatulence
- Freshman Team
- Posts: 204
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:08 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
As they would say on Dumb and Dumber - "Most excellent Dude Hoffman!"
Re: where would you send you child for track
I was thinking. yes it does happen. To a casual observer or fan it does look like cc and track coaches don't do anything. What do coaches do doing the competition? It appears to be just the kids getting ready and competing with the coach watching. The coaching takes place at practice with tiny adjustments taking place during the meet.
How much fun and how much harder would it be for a basketball or football coach to prepare thier kids during the week and then let them preform with the only instruction or coaching be a few words from the stands. it would be up to the kids to execute the plays and game plan without a constant reminder of what to do.
How much fun and how much harder would it be for a basketball or football coach to prepare thier kids during the week and then let them preform with the only instruction or coaching be a few words from the stands. it would be up to the kids to execute the plays and game plan without a constant reminder of what to do.
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Rich Hoffman
- Waterboy
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- Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:25 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
Which is exactly the way it should be for the activity to have any long term, meaningful impact on the student's development and growth, which is the true purpose and goal of athletics. This business of calling a time-out evry whipstitch and micro managing every aspect of competition detracts from overall development and value of sport.
To me, there is something elegant to the calm, patient demeanor of the meet day coach who after a week or weeks of instruction, preparation, and tutelage mostly quietly and unobtrusively supports his/her young student as they attempt to navigate the path of competition, content in the knowledge that they have their best to prepare them, and now it is time for the young student to take over and, making decisions largely on their own, demonstrate their present mastery of their chosen event. The latin definition of "compete" is "to seek together" - meaning that we are to seek, on a journey with our fellow competitiors, our best performance (and that may or may not mean that we 'beat' our fellow competitors. Therefore we compete as part of a process, not a final outcome, and though we may strive and desire a specific outcome, in the final analysis, that is not what is ultimately important, particularly in something as ultimately meaningless as an athletic contest. Athletics are simultaneously meaningful and meaningless. That is the grand paradox. Competition should be about the meaningful things it brings to your life, not about the ultimately meaningless final outcomes and scores. John Wooden said it best when he said (paraphrased) 'we never talked about beating another team or winning. There were some nights we won when we did not 'win', there were some nights we lost when we 'won'. ' I believe a coach who is willing to teach during the week, then stand back and let the young athlete compete to the best of their ability with occasional comments and suggestions, and then help them correct for the future, is much more the coach than the person who has to scream at every turn and mis-step and micro-manage every move and play. Where does the student learn to gain more autonomy, independence, maturity, and responsibility and self-reliance than when, alone in the crucible of competition, they must reach inside and make those crucial decisions and adjustments under 'pressure', (which is again, is only a microcosm of life, not the real presure one will face as an employee, spouse, or parent)? In my humble opinion, the person who must scream and micromanage every aspect of competition is more concerned with the outcome, and wins and losses, and how they might look, and people's outside perceptions, than they are with the true function and value of athletics.
And at the end of the day, the coach stand back and watch as the athlete embraces the competition, makes the best possible decision that they can, and the learns to live with the outcome and learn for the next competition. Win, lose, or draw, the coach can draw satisfaction as he watches the young athlete draw ever closer to adulthood with another meaningful and significant learning experience under their belt, performed within the ultimately insignificant realm of athletics.
To me, there is something elegant to the calm, patient demeanor of the meet day coach who after a week or weeks of instruction, preparation, and tutelage mostly quietly and unobtrusively supports his/her young student as they attempt to navigate the path of competition, content in the knowledge that they have their best to prepare them, and now it is time for the young student to take over and, making decisions largely on their own, demonstrate their present mastery of their chosen event. The latin definition of "compete" is "to seek together" - meaning that we are to seek, on a journey with our fellow competitiors, our best performance (and that may or may not mean that we 'beat' our fellow competitors. Therefore we compete as part of a process, not a final outcome, and though we may strive and desire a specific outcome, in the final analysis, that is not what is ultimately important, particularly in something as ultimately meaningless as an athletic contest. Athletics are simultaneously meaningful and meaningless. That is the grand paradox. Competition should be about the meaningful things it brings to your life, not about the ultimately meaningless final outcomes and scores. John Wooden said it best when he said (paraphrased) 'we never talked about beating another team or winning. There were some nights we won when we did not 'win', there were some nights we lost when we 'won'. ' I believe a coach who is willing to teach during the week, then stand back and let the young athlete compete to the best of their ability with occasional comments and suggestions, and then help them correct for the future, is much more the coach than the person who has to scream at every turn and mis-step and micro-manage every move and play. Where does the student learn to gain more autonomy, independence, maturity, and responsibility and self-reliance than when, alone in the crucible of competition, they must reach inside and make those crucial decisions and adjustments under 'pressure', (which is again, is only a microcosm of life, not the real presure one will face as an employee, spouse, or parent)? In my humble opinion, the person who must scream and micromanage every aspect of competition is more concerned with the outcome, and wins and losses, and how they might look, and people's outside perceptions, than they are with the true function and value of athletics.
And at the end of the day, the coach stand back and watch as the athlete embraces the competition, makes the best possible decision that they can, and the learns to live with the outcome and learn for the next competition. Win, lose, or draw, the coach can draw satisfaction as he watches the young athlete draw ever closer to adulthood with another meaningful and significant learning experience under their belt, performed within the ultimately insignificant realm of athletics.
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Flatulence
- Freshman Team
- Posts: 204
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:08 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
Aaaaaaaah, John Wooden - the coach i most wanted to emulate. I have read his book "They Call Me Coach" a couple of times and his ideas were considered "strange" at the time. When it came to what happened on the court he believed his players would respond determined by their practice habits, their locker room demeanor and habits, and their social lives. He believed that those who stressed winning in games left themselves vulnerable to criticisms and that those who prepared their athletes in ALL phases of life that winning would occur. "Digger" Phelps of Notre Dame came from the same laboratory of thought and that is why his teams and UCLA had some very contested games. He and Coach wooden were a mutual admiration society.
In today's culture it is even more difficult to help athletes develop the habits of yesteryear that were and are SO important to being successful. The trash talking in sports today and the way high school athletes want to emulate it frightens me. What's next? It used to be "easy" to get athletes to prepare for an upcoming contest and have their bag packed the night before. Not today. If it is once it is hundreds of times I am reminding and checking our athletes to have their equipment prepared for the next competition, but invariably the morning the bus is to leave and at the very time it is to leave we have someone come flying in and have nothing ready. Last year I began doing what I did at the very beginning of my career - I left them. Then, if they wanted to really be there parents had to bring them and get their stuff. It helped - a couple of them had their ears chewed on the entire trip to the track.
Now, Rich, as far as the calm and elegant demeanor - well that is not me! I am as nervous as a cat on a hot tin roof and my demeanor is far from elegant! Hell, I don't know that I would ever want to be called elegant!
This has become an interesting conversation.
In today's culture it is even more difficult to help athletes develop the habits of yesteryear that were and are SO important to being successful. The trash talking in sports today and the way high school athletes want to emulate it frightens me. What's next? It used to be "easy" to get athletes to prepare for an upcoming contest and have their bag packed the night before. Not today. If it is once it is hundreds of times I am reminding and checking our athletes to have their equipment prepared for the next competition, but invariably the morning the bus is to leave and at the very time it is to leave we have someone come flying in and have nothing ready. Last year I began doing what I did at the very beginning of my career - I left them. Then, if they wanted to really be there parents had to bring them and get their stuff. It helped - a couple of them had their ears chewed on the entire trip to the track.
Now, Rich, as far as the calm and elegant demeanor - well that is not me! I am as nervous as a cat on a hot tin roof and my demeanor is far from elegant! Hell, I don't know that I would ever want to be called elegant!
This has become an interesting conversation.-
Charles Farquar
- JV Team
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- Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2006 12:47 pm
Re: where would you send you child for track
I coached both football and track and field, and my football coaching buddies one time said how hard can it be you just tell them to run around and around to their left. They had no idea what it was like to learn about each event and organize effective practices. At the school I coached at one of the Athletic Directors told me as soon as Football and Basketball were over he was basically done. He would set up a schedule for me and then it was up to me to set up the meets, I needed to get all the help for every meet and line the throwing areas and set up the hurdles and organzie hurdle crews and find a scorekeeper and finally get officials. I don't think a lot of people realize what work it is to put on meets. Especially in a community where track and field is not taken that seriously. Asking people to help and not knowing if they would show up, that was not something that I enjoyed about it. I had a core of helpers whose kids had graduated and they still helped because they liked the sport. A lot of the parents with kids on the team would not even come to the meets to watch their kids let alone help with the events. Then they pay the football coach $10,000 a season , I guess for taking heat from the community.We were still able to run a pretty good meet on time.
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Rich Hoffman
- Waterboy
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- Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:25 am
Re: where would you send you child for track
Ok, Greg, maybe calm and elegant demeanor wasn't the best depiction...I wasn't necessarily advocating that we all sit quietly on our hands, I guess I was more speaking to the actions I see on the occasional moment I turn on the TV and catch certain sport coaches about to have a coronary and their veins and arteries about to burst through their skin, they look like someone has just killed their last 10 pet dogs, and they appear as if they hate being where they are doing what they are doing. I think it's great to be enthusiastic and vocally supportive, and each has to allow their natural personality to come through, and it has to be (in my opinion) about the same on meet day as it is on practice day. If a calm laid back coach on practice days suddenly becomes overly anxious and agitated on meet day, I believe the kids pick up on that and start to lose their calm focus.
Greg, you may like a cat on a hot tin roof, but it's in a positive way. I think we all, like you, are nervous and anticipating what the outcome is, but I think there is a difference between being nervous and antsy about whether we have taught and prepared our students well, versus being anxious about how their performance will reflect on us and our won-loss record, and as a result letting the negative emotions get carried away and negatively influencing our behavior. I've changed my perspective on athltics over the years, and while we all like to win and be in the spotlight to a degree, I like to think of athletic competition as a small laboratory, where the kids can potentially blow something up, but instead of it being a house of place of business, it's a small pop and a test tube. I've had to learn that, and I thiunk it has allowed me to become a better coach by maintaining a less worried, looser and calmer outlook.
We all get a little wound up about people packing their bag and being prepared and having all the necessities, and that covers more than just the 'travel bag'. I think at some point, in order to enforce the life lessons we talk about, we do have to occasionally leave someone behind and make them pay the price for not being attentive and prepared. I've had to do it. Sometimes I have to be 'stern' with a student about transgressions, and sometimes they take it and learn and sometimes they don't. 2 years ago the night before districts I had to sit our #6 runner because during the run he was walking, carrying a Bow (as in bow and arrow) and swinging it at teammates. Another time I had to pull an outstanding jr high runner aside, and read the riot act because of several incidents of throwing, not mild but real haymaker type, elbows during races. I expressed that this was unacceptable. In both cases I lost both runners for the long term. But the lessons to be taught I felt were necessary. I find it ironic that at some of Division I athletic factories (oops, educational institutions), they actually practice having them get on and off a bus, riding on a bus, going to a hotel, staying in a hotel...all before the season starts. Wow. Meanwhile, collegiate mens track and cross country programs are getting cut left and right to maintain budgets and Title IX ratios.
I hope I'm not hijacking this discussion. I want to share a little something. Some of you may be familiar with the name Steve taylor, he ran at little St Marys HS up from Parkersburg back in the early 80's. I think he ran around 4:10 for the 1600 and 8:58 for 3200 if I recall, finished 3rd and 7th in the Kinney national XC meet (now Footlocker meet). Here's a little something from him, a caption on a picture of him after a race:
"Moments after winning the HS 3,000M (8:27) at the 1983 Penn Relays. After a slow start, :122246 it took 55.8 :122246 for the final 400M to pass Miles Irish (Burnt Hills, NY) at the line.
Coach Rea had to fight the SSAC of West Virginia to gain permission for me to race since no one from WV had ever competed at the Penn Relays. The SSAC agreed to "allow me" to go provided I did not accept any award if I won. Coach Rea agreed, so afterwards my brother Mike went and collected my watch for winning. So, I did not accept the award...my brother did (LOL)...
After the race, we drove through the night from Philadelphia to get back home to St Marys in time for the LKC Championships the next day. After arriving at 4:30AM...I asked coach Rea if I could sleep in and come to the meet with my parents later in the morning since I didn't race until 1PM. He calmly said, "no Steve, if you want to race today you will be on the bus at 7:30AM with your teammates."...Needless to say, I was on the bus 3 hours later. Set the LKC records in the 800M and 1600M and led off the winning 4x400M relay helping our team win the Championship. I've always appreciated that Coach Rea did that...Miss the bus and you did not race. It was very simple."
My added comment - think about this...Steve had just won the Penn Relays (most prestigious high school track meet in the country), and his coach made him be on the bus the next morning to be with his team for their league meet - if he wanted to run.
Greg, you may like a cat on a hot tin roof, but it's in a positive way. I think we all, like you, are nervous and anticipating what the outcome is, but I think there is a difference between being nervous and antsy about whether we have taught and prepared our students well, versus being anxious about how their performance will reflect on us and our won-loss record, and as a result letting the negative emotions get carried away and negatively influencing our behavior. I've changed my perspective on athltics over the years, and while we all like to win and be in the spotlight to a degree, I like to think of athletic competition as a small laboratory, where the kids can potentially blow something up, but instead of it being a house of place of business, it's a small pop and a test tube. I've had to learn that, and I thiunk it has allowed me to become a better coach by maintaining a less worried, looser and calmer outlook.
We all get a little wound up about people packing their bag and being prepared and having all the necessities, and that covers more than just the 'travel bag'. I think at some point, in order to enforce the life lessons we talk about, we do have to occasionally leave someone behind and make them pay the price for not being attentive and prepared. I've had to do it. Sometimes I have to be 'stern' with a student about transgressions, and sometimes they take it and learn and sometimes they don't. 2 years ago the night before districts I had to sit our #6 runner because during the run he was walking, carrying a Bow (as in bow and arrow) and swinging it at teammates. Another time I had to pull an outstanding jr high runner aside, and read the riot act because of several incidents of throwing, not mild but real haymaker type, elbows during races. I expressed that this was unacceptable. In both cases I lost both runners for the long term. But the lessons to be taught I felt were necessary. I find it ironic that at some of Division I athletic factories (oops, educational institutions), they actually practice having them get on and off a bus, riding on a bus, going to a hotel, staying in a hotel...all before the season starts. Wow. Meanwhile, collegiate mens track and cross country programs are getting cut left and right to maintain budgets and Title IX ratios.
I hope I'm not hijacking this discussion. I want to share a little something. Some of you may be familiar with the name Steve taylor, he ran at little St Marys HS up from Parkersburg back in the early 80's. I think he ran around 4:10 for the 1600 and 8:58 for 3200 if I recall, finished 3rd and 7th in the Kinney national XC meet (now Footlocker meet). Here's a little something from him, a caption on a picture of him after a race:
"Moments after winning the HS 3,000M (8:27) at the 1983 Penn Relays. After a slow start, :122246 it took 55.8 :122246 for the final 400M to pass Miles Irish (Burnt Hills, NY) at the line.
Coach Rea had to fight the SSAC of West Virginia to gain permission for me to race since no one from WV had ever competed at the Penn Relays. The SSAC agreed to "allow me" to go provided I did not accept any award if I won. Coach Rea agreed, so afterwards my brother Mike went and collected my watch for winning. So, I did not accept the award...my brother did (LOL)...
After the race, we drove through the night from Philadelphia to get back home to St Marys in time for the LKC Championships the next day. After arriving at 4:30AM...I asked coach Rea if I could sleep in and come to the meet with my parents later in the morning since I didn't race until 1PM. He calmly said, "no Steve, if you want to race today you will be on the bus at 7:30AM with your teammates."...Needless to say, I was on the bus 3 hours later. Set the LKC records in the 800M and 1600M and led off the winning 4x400M relay helping our team win the Championship. I've always appreciated that Coach Rea did that...Miss the bus and you did not race. It was very simple."
My added comment - think about this...Steve had just won the Penn Relays (most prestigious high school track meet in the country), and his coach made him be on the bus the next morning to be with his team for their league meet - if he wanted to run.
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ironmen1987
- SE
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Re: where would you send you child for track
I've enjoyed reading thru the posts. I think I was pretty much the only one that was commenting on the topic anyway. I enjoy your passion for the sport and the sharing of helpful information. Best of luck on the upcoming season.
Re: where would you send you child for track
This is all great insight. I'm always looking to listen to the philosophies of other coaches.
One interesting thing about Wooden was that he was "criticized" because he hardly left the bench during the games. This just goes to show how well coached UCLA truly was. I know this has been discussed, and Rich posted a great quote about it, but my major goal as a coach is to in theory be absent from the meet and have my team run itself. I feel if teams are able to operate without the coach present, then the coach has done his or her job.
One interesting thing about Wooden was that he was "criticized" because he hardly left the bench during the games. This just goes to show how well coached UCLA truly was. I know this has been discussed, and Rich posted a great quote about it, but my major goal as a coach is to in theory be absent from the meet and have my team run itself. I feel if teams are able to operate without the coach present, then the coach has done his or her job.
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Orange and Brown
- SEOPS Mr. Ohio
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Re: where would you send you child for track
It took Wooden years and years to start winning. He was basicle a .500 coach for a little over half of his carreer....He would never get the chance to build a program today.
Re: where would you send you child for track
Orange and Brown,
No disrespect meant here, but Wooden never had a losing season his entire career in coaching. His worst season was 14-12 in '59-'60. He never had any other season in which there wasn't at least a six game difference between wins and losses. It did however take him 16 seasons at UCLA before he won a national championship.
No disrespect meant here, but Wooden never had a losing season his entire career in coaching. His worst season was 14-12 in '59-'60. He never had any other season in which there wasn't at least a six game difference between wins and losses. It did however take him 16 seasons at UCLA before he won a national championship.