Could Michigan lose out?

[Peake]

85,

Those are not excuses. That is reality. I live in a different world then you do. I know the program, you not so much. You can continue to challenge me or except reality. You can not give me one piece of evidence that makes my point moot. It really is getting old.

If you think Michigan is still the old Michigan then you are probably THE ONLY ONE on this board.

[Orestes]

Just by looking at depth charts, this is what I came up with in comparing class rank between Michigan and OSU.


Michigan Offense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 1
Sophomores - 5
Juniors - 2
Seniors - 3

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 4
Sophomores - 2
Juniors - 2
Seniors - 3

That's 12 Freshmen and Sophomores in the two-deep offense.

Michigan Defense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 1
Sophomores - 5
Juniors - 4
Seniors - 1

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 4
Sophomores - 2
Juniors - 5
Seniors - 0

That's 12 Freshmen and Sophomores in the two-deep defense.



Ohio State Offense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 1
Sophomores - 6
Juniors - 3
Seniors - 1

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 5
Sophomores - 1
Juniors - 3
Seniors - 2

That's 13 Freshmen and Sophomores in the two-deep offense.

OSU Defense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 0
Sophomores - 0
Juniors - 8
Seniors - 3

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 4
Sophomores -3
Juniors - 0
Seniors - 4

That's 7 Freshmen and Sophomores in the OSU two-deep defense.

[Peake]

The difference is on defense IMO.

Both UM and OSU's young offenses look inconsistent at times,a mark of a young team, but the difference is on the D. Ohio State has a starting defense made up of all upper classmen.

[85inside]

85,

Those are not excuses. That is reality. I live in a different world then you do. I know the program, you not so much. You can continue to challenge me or except reality. You can not give me one piece of evidence that makes my point moot. It really is getting old.

If you think Michigan is still the old Michigan then you are probably THE ONLY ONE on this board.

I have not "challenged" you one time on here. I dont challenge folks, i state facts. 3-9, fact. 1-3 in last 4 games, fact. Many kids left when Rodriguez came aboard, fact. Lloyd Carr never went 3-9 fact. Llyod Carr never lost to Toledo, fact. Lloyd Carr's biggest regular season win was Ohio State and Penn State repeatedly, fact. Rich Rodriguez' biggest regular season win was Louisville on a thursday night one time.
You can trash Lloyd Carr all you want. You can say he left the well dry all you want. the fact is that Lloyd always won. When MAC schools were on the schedule, they were drubbings, not losses.

[noreply66]

6 and 6 for the boys up North

[Mikenmike]

He did a good job beating app state when Michigan was #5 in the country didn't he

[Peake]

85 is a complete moron.

Last year was 3-9 wioth the worst team in recent memory.


This is not last year.You can bring up Toledo all you want, Lloyd Carr lost to App State while ranked #5 in the country with one of the more tlaneted teams in recent history.

Michigan is 1-3 in the last 4 games because they played the #4 team in the country to a 2-point loss at their place, lost to a better team in Penn State, and lost to a rival.

Michigan also beat a rival in ND. I believe from a talebnt standpoint ND all around is better and they beat them. I am ok with that.

You missed out on the fact that from 2005-2008 17 players have left the program, and a good majority of those came from 2005-2007 (while Carr was here).

He did leave the well dry and if you can not see that then that is your problem.

Rich beat both MAC teams on the schd easily this season, I really do not know what you want.

You have an ax to grind, it is apparent

[85inside]

85 is a complete moron.
Last year was 3-9 wioth the worst team in recent memory.


This is not last year.You can bring up Toledo all you want, Lloyd Carr lost to App State while ranked #5 in the country with one of the more tlaneted teams in recent history.

Michigan is 1-3 in the last 4 games because they played the #4 team in the country to a 2-point loss at their place, lost to a better team in Penn State, and lost to a rival.

Michigan also beat a rival in ND. I believe from a talebnt standpoint ND all around is better and they beat them. I am ok with that.

You missed out on the fact that from 2005-2008 17 players have left the program, and a good majority of those came from 2005-2007 (while Carr was here).

He did leave the well dry and if you can not see that then that is your problem.

Rich beat both MAC teams on the schd easily this season, I really do not know what you want.

You have an ax to grind, it is apparent

When you are wrong it is time for name calling. I have never stooped to name calling. Penn State is a better team, but did you just lose to the Lions? No, the Wolverines got smeered at home to a team that Lloyd Carr owned. I am glad you guys are good with being mediocre. Keep drinking the koolaid.

[candystore]

michigan will not lose out, but thier last win very well could be against Illinois

[Peake]

I am done arguing with you. I am just calling a spade a spade. You have an ax to grind so you continually put up smeer information to further your case. You would fit in great at the Free Press.

Michigan did go 3-9----last year---this is not last year.

Michigan did lose to a MAC school last year---this is not last year. They have blown out both MAC schools they have played this season. If you want to continue beating that dead horse then you should stop. I have never been more embarrassed then when Michigan lost to App State while returning Mario Manningham, Jake Long, Chad Henne, Mike Hart, Adrian Arrington, Shawn Crable, etc. Get over it and move on.

Yes we got it handed to us by PSU. They are a better team. Are they 25 points better, probably not, but they sure as hell were that night. I was at the game and they looked like they were clicking that night. Michigan did not help themselves and turned it over way too many times. True mark of a young team.

You can continue bringing up the Lloyd Carr comparisons all you want, but all of Lloyds teams were more talented and more experienced then this one. Lloyd Carr is not our coach anymore and I am extremly happy about that.

I am not happy with being mediocre, but I am realistic. It takes time to build a team. Lane Kiffin is 3-4 at this point. I am sure they will be a power in do time, but right now they are struggling. They are struggling at Nebraska right now, Washington, etc. It takes time to build these teams. Not everyone can walk into Urban Meyers position and have the players in place.

I am not going to listen to someone who does not know the program try and give me advice on how I should feel and what my expectations should be.

[85inside]

I am done arguing with you. I am just calling a spade a spade. You have an ax to grind so you continually put up smeer information to further your case. You would fit in great at the Free Press.

Michigan did go 3-9----last year---this is not last year.

Michigan did lose to a MAC school last year---this is not last year. They have blown out both MAC schools they have played this season. If you want to continue beating that dead horse then you should stop. I have never been more embarrassed then when Michigan lost to App State while returning Mario Manningham, Jake Long, Chad Henne, Mike Hart, Adrian Arrington, Shawn Crable, etc. Get over it and move on.

Yes we got it handed to us by PSU. They are a better team. Are they 25 points better, probably not, but they sure as hell were that night. I was at the game and they looked like they were clicking that night. Michigan did not help themselves and turned it over way too many times. True mark of a young team.

You can continue bringing up the Lloyd Carr comparisons all you want, but all of Lloyds teams were more talented and more experienced then this one. Lloyd Carr is not our coach anymore and I am extremly happy about that.

I am not happy with being mediocre, but I am realistic. It takes time to build a team. Lane Kiffin is 3-4 at this point. I am sure they will be a power in do time, but right now they are struggling. They are struggling at Nebraska right now, Washington, etc. It takes time to build these teams. Not everyone can walk into Urban Meyers position and have the players in place.

I am not going to listen to someone who does not know the program try and give me advice on how I should feel and what my expectations should be.

While i agree with you that Lane Kiffin is an excellent comparison to RR, i would like to ask you why you feel that Kiffin will automatically win at UT. If the answer is because his dad is one heck of a D coordinator and you feel he is going to be around a long time, i would tend to agree with that. however, please tell me what Kiffin has ever won to think he is on the track to be a great coach? RR won at WVA, but outside of a sugar bowl win over Georgia, he never really won any big games. At least any big games played on Saturday.

Kiffin and RR are valued greatly by the press. But other than RR can recruit, what has either of them done?
For the record, I would be litterallly shocked if Michigan didnt finish at least 7-5 this year. Really after the start they had they shouldnt lose more than 1 more.
Quite interesting that you say that you can accept Michigan losing to Michigan State, while in the same year calling for MSU to fire Dantonio.

[Peake]

To answer one of your many questions, I think Kiffin will be a good coach because he can recruit.

He and his staff are already one of the best recruiting staffs in all of America. He will bring in talent and has proven is only a few months that he can recruit in a hurry. Yes his Dad is a heck of a D coordinator, and Lane will get him the players he needs to be successful.

Kiffin has been a head coach for all of what, a half year? The Radiers job was a joke from the start. I am not putting all of that on him. So far he has played UF down to the wire, and gave his average team a shot to beat a team that many think is the best team in college football. He will win at UT.

Your logic is so flawed I do not know where to start. Michigan started 4-0, but since have played the meat of their schd. They are not good enough to not show up and win games. The way they started has nothing to do with the way they finish.

I do not accept any loss, but I am able to see the big picture.

[fightingtigers45]

Lane Kiffin is 3-4 at this point. I am sure they will be a power in do time, but right now they are struggling.

Although I dislike Kiffin and his program, I wouldnt say they are struggling...They had the best two teams in the country on the ropes in the 4th quarter and they hammered one of their rivals, Georgia. People expected Tennessee to lose to Bama and Florida, but did they expect Tennessee to play them like they did? No. Yes the losses to Auburn and UCLA dont look too good, but those are long forgotten in Tennessee after their showing against Bama. Kiffin is showing he can do it.

Just by looking at depth charts, this is what I came up with in comparing class rank between Michigan and OSU.


Michigan Offense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 1
Sophomores - 5
Juniors - 2
Seniors - 3

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 4
Sophomores - 2
Juniors - 2
Seniors - 3

That's 12 Freshmen and Sophomores in the two-deep offense.

Michigan Defense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 1
Sophomores - 5
Juniors - 4
Seniors - 1

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 4
Sophomores - 2
Juniors - 5
Seniors - 0

That's 12 Freshmen and Sophomores in the two-deep defense.



Ohio State Offense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 1
Sophomores - 6
Juniors - 3
Seniors - 1

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 5
Sophomores - 1
Juniors - 3
Seniors - 2

That's 13 Freshmen and Sophomores in the two-deep offense.

OSU Defense:

1st Team:

Freshmen - 0
Sophomores - 0
Juniors - 8
Seniors - 3

2nd Team:

Freshmen - 4
Sophomores -3
Juniors - 0
Seniors - 4

That's 7 Freshmen and Sophomores in the OSU two-deep defense.

If you want to use that logic, then here you go...Looks like Florida will be staying on top forever

Florida depth chart:

Two-deep offense
Frosh-6
Soph-7

The Gators have 13 underclassmen in their two-deep offense.


Two-deep defense
Frosh-3
Soph-4

The Gators have 7 underclassmen in their two-deep defense.

[85inside]

So a guy can perform in the living room, makes him a good coach? OK. i guess time will tell. By the way, since Lane has only been a coach for 1/2 a year, how the heck did he land a job limke UT? You would think they would have gone with some experience? At least Rodriguez had some Thursday night coaching experience at WVU.

[fightingtigers45]

So a guy can perform in the living room, makes him a good coach? OK. i guess time will tell. By the way, since Lane has only been a coach for 1/2 a year, how the heck did he land a job limke UT? You would think they would have gone with some experience? At least Rodriguez had some Thursday night coaching experience at WVU.

[Lloyd Xmas]

85 is not a complete moron .... maybe just a partial moron. However, I'll bet he's a heck of a fisherman. He can bait a hook that will catch peake every time.

[Peake]

When it comes to Michigan football he is a moron.

In other things in life, I have no opinion.

This is not a Florida-Michigan debate, but let me point this out---Florida has 56 under classmen on their roster (Fr-RSoph)---Michigan has 90.

So that means 90 of the 125 man roster are under classmen. You do the math.

That is a huge disadvantage from several different view points. There are only 35 players who have been here for 3-5 years. That is huge from a leadership standpoint, strength, conditioning, experience on the field, in the film room, etc.

[Peake]

I just looked at the official depth chart for the Illinois game.

On offense Michigan has 17 under classmen on the depth chart
Tate
Denard
Vincent Smith
Kevin Koger
Brandon Moore
Mark Huyge
Elliot Mealer
Ricky Barnum
Patrick Omameh
Daryl Stonum
Mike Shaw
Rocko Koury
Kelvin Grady
Odoms
JeRon Stokes
Roundtree
Robinson

On Defense they have 22 on the depth chart

[fightingtigers45]

This is not a Florida-Michigan debate, but let me point this out---Florida has 56 under classmen on their roster (Fr-RSoph)---Michigan has 90.

So that means 90 of the 125 man roster are under classmen. You do the math.

That is a huge disadvantage from several different view points. There are only 35 players who have been here for 3-5 years. That is huge from a leadership standpoint, strength, conditioning, experience on the field, in the film room, etc.

I completely agree and I wasnt mentioning Florida's depth chart to show their youth because they have a veteran team...I was simply pointing out that Florida had identical numbers to Ohio State and that is was flawed logic completely...Notice the eye roll in my post.

[Peake]

^^^ I C---My bad


I looked at OSU's depth chart today

13 under classmen on the depth chart on offense and 8 on defense