Marshall Football 2010

[hdfatboy]

Ohhh they Flying Saucer 250 beers on tap, yummy

Actually they changed their name to 80's enough or something to that affect. I heard them and they are great.

hdfatboy,

More then anything I think I just enjoyed the debate. I respect that you choose to raise your family in whatever place you choose. Like I said it was more just for the sake of debate. You are a very educated person and I enjoyed the conversation. Good day.

You too Peake. Like I said, if I were a little younger and without kids, I'd rather live in Raleigh too.

[marshallman]

Peake, all that stat stuff is well informed info. It appears to me Morgantown is better educated than NC. Also, home is where the heart is, if your not happy where you are at it doesn't matter what the location has to offer or we would all live in Hawaii. I have 10 friends I graduated from college with and they all live in NC, I see them a lot and have been all over that state but it doesn't make me drool to move there.

You say Marshall will never get a 5 star player is ludicrous. Marshall needs the right coach and they will come. Like I said before it didn't take 5 star players to beat Michigan when they played Appy Stat and Toledo. Doc, got a late start and has already brought in talent that would embarrass Snyder's 5 years combined. Why would these players decommit from WVU and go to Marshall? Is it because they found out Huntington has Pullman Square? No, It's because of Doc.

[earp]

We have already had so called "5 star guys" here!Moss,Pennington,Leftwich do those guys ring a bell??But they became those kind of players after the fact that someone gave them a chance! And lets face it Moss was down to his last chance when he came to Marshall!I just think too much emphasis is being put on these ratings!No one really knows whats going to happen!I am sure some of those 5 star guys have been complete flops???Marshall needs to start proving it on the field again like in years past!

[earp]

Heres the latest!

http://www.herald-dispatch.com/sports/x ... r-prospect

[Peake]

Who was a single 5-star guy that Marshall has ever gotten? Moss was supposed to be at Notre Dame or FSU, not Marshall. Pennington was a 6'4, 190 coming out of high school only recruited by 1-aa schools. He developed and was a great story, but he is of the choosen few that this ever happens to. Many people point to Joe Flacco who was a 1-aa QB who is now a starting QB in the NFL, but he was a 4-star at Pitt before he was ever a 1-aa QB. Look at the QB's now who are elite.

Brady- Was around a 4-star type of guy coming out of high school.
Manning-5-star
Eli-4 to 5-star
McNabb was around a 4-star

then you have your exceptions, but Heene(5-star) is going to take over in Miami for Pennington.

Lets not forget that it took Pennington 5 years to develop into a NFL prospect. Leftwich was another animal. He was raw raw raw raw. He went to a high school that most coaches would not even visit. I still remember the commercials with Pruitt talking about needing a QB the year Byron was to take over. Oh how he ate his words.

Anyways, people can say it is a hit and miss system, which to an extent is true, but research says different.

SSC looked at the Rivals.com rankings from 2002 and 2003 and compared them to the all-conference teams for the ACC, Big Ten, Big 12, Pac-10, and SEC from 2002-2007. (The Big East was excluded because some of the current members were not members of a BCS conference in 2002 or 2003.) They found the following probabilities of a prospect with a particular star rating being named all-conference at some point in his career...

•5-stars 33.8%
•4-stars 20.0%
•3-stars 11.6%
•2-stars 7.2%
In other words, despite the existence of "can't miss" prospects who miss badly, in general more stars are better. A 5-star recruit is almost 70% more likely to be named all-conference than a 4-star and makes all-conference at nearly triple the rate of 3-star prospects.

[earp]

Good post!But remember I didnsay in my post that they did develop later on!Just curious how many of the 5 star guys have been flops?Any come to mind??

[theassassin]

Peake, all that stat stuff is well informed info. It appears to me Morgantown is better educated than NC. Also, home is where the heart is, if your not happy where you are at it doesn't matter what the location has to offer or we would all live in Hawaii. I have 10 friends I graduated from college with and they all live in NC, I see them a lot and have been all over that state but it doesn't make me drool to move there.

You say Marshall will never get a 5 star player is ludicrous. Marshall needs the right coach and they will come. Like I said before it didn't take 5 star players to beat Michigan when they played Appy Stat and Toledo. Doc, got a late start and has already brought in talent that would embarrass Snyder's 5 years combined. Why would these players decommit from WVU and go to Marshall? Is it because they found out Huntington has Pullman Square? No, It's because of Doc.

doc hasnt brought them in yet.... they are verbal committments as of now. we all know how binding a verbal committment is. already, 2 of the 3 decomitts from wvu are wavering on their committment to marshall. until they sign and make it on campus he has not brought them in.

[Peake]

Earp,

Willie Williams---Miami---had more arrests then tackles
Xavier Lee---FSU---Flop
Xavier Carter---LSU---Awful football player but one of the fasted humans alive---9.8 100m
Fred Rouse---FSU---Is now at UTEP
Kevin Grady---Michigan---lifetime backup
Mitch Mustain---Arkansas---Now at USC
Jai Eugene---LSU
Kyle Wright---Miami


Just to further my point, take a look at some of these 5-stars: Bennie Wells, Ernie Sims, Chad Heene, Lamaar Woodley, Eric Berry, Brandon Graham, Greg Olson, Donte Whitner, Antonio Carmartie, Mario Williams, Adrian Peterson, Ted Ginn Jr, Fred Davis, Dan Conner, Derrick Harvey, Glenn Dorsey, Matthew Stafford, Vince Young, Calvin Johnson....just a few taht were all 5-star guys that are playing or will be in the NFL this season.

[Speedofsand]

Who are WVU's 5 * this year ? I think if you want to keep talking about 5* players, stay in the SEC. The SEC has more 5* than all other conferences combined. Doc is already taking WVU kids. You think Stewart will win the Big East ? Against Randy Edsal, Charlie Strong, Wannstedt, Schiano, Holtz ?? Go to Marshall and win or go to WVU and lose in a BCS conference.

[Peake]

5-stars per Scout

Big 12-12 (all from Oklahoma and Texas except 2 from A&M)
SEC-13 (Florida 5, Alabama 3, Auburn 2, Georgia 2, Ole Miss 1)
ACC-4
Big 10-6
Pac 10-9
Big East-2

WVU has 1 5-star----Bruce Irvin, JC and Latwan Anderson should be a 5-star and is on rivals.

BTW,

Texas has more 5-stars then any team in the country Mr. SEC and Oklahoma and Texas have more than any two SEC schools combined.

So I am not math major but your statement is false about the SEC.

[Speedofsand]

2010 class per rivals = SEC 11, the rest 10

ACC
total commits---- 231
5* commits------ 2
4* commits------ 48
4*/5* commits-- 50
% of commits who are either 4* or 5*--- 22%


Big 12
total commits---- 263
5* commits------ zero (2 now Jeffcoat , Hicks)
4* commits------ 78
4*/5* commits-- 78
% of commits who are either 4* or 5*--- 30

Big East
total commits---- 162
5* commits------ 1
4* commits------ 13
4*/5* commits-- 14
% of commits who are either 4* or 5*--- 9%

Big 10
total commits---- 227
5* commits------ 1
4* commits------ 37
4*/5* commits-- 38
% of commits who are either 4* or 5*--- 17%

PAC 10
total commits---- 197
5* commits------ 4
4* commits------ 53
4*/5* commits-- 57
% of commits who are either 4* or 5*--- 29%

SEC
total commits---- 266
5* commits------ 11
4* commits------ 89
4*/5* commits-- 100
% of commits who are either 4* or 5*--- 38%

Final ranking

Percent of commits in conference who are either 4* or 5*
SEC------ 38%
Big 12---- 30%
PAC 10--- 29%
ACC------ 22%
Big 10---- 17%
Big East--- 9%

[Chained Eagle]

[theassassin]

Who are WVU's 5 * this year ? I think if you want to keep talking about 5* players, stay in the SEC. The SEC has more 5* than all other conferences combined. Doc is already taking WVU kids. You think Stewart will win the Big East ? Against Randy Edsal, Charlie Strong, Wannstedt, Schiano, Holtz ?? Go to Marshall and win or go to WVU and lose in a BCS conference.

not sure anyone commented about wvu signing a bunch of 5*s so not sure what your point is. peake is right though.... this year they have bruce irvin a juco already enrolled. LA is a 5* on some sites. barry brunetti a starter in the AA game and also high school all american probly should be.
last years class they signed tavon austin a 5*. say what you want about stewart buti would bet in 3 yrs he will have signed as many 5* players to wvu as any of their previous coaches.
will stewart win the big east. i dont know the answer to that anymore than you do but i have faith that they will. the staff is definitely bringing in higher caliber talent than ever before..... what has wannstedt done at spitt??? this year they had their first 10 win season under him and they lost to wvu. i like randy edsall but uconn has never beaten wvu since joining the big east. schiano? see above. strong has proven nothing as a head coach. probly a good hire for ul (i hope it is) but the jury is still out. holtz? had some success at ecu but is stepping up to a bcs conference. like strong... the jury is still out.

like i said before and you ignored... doc has taken noone from wvu yet. bell, millenes and pickett have decomitted. also like i said before 2 of the 3 are waivering on their committs to marsha college...
bell- waivering. says he may not sign until after signing day(if he hesitates signing with wvu he might find the offer pulled. there is rumor it has already been pulled due to wvu getting a silent verbal from a higher rated prospect).
milleness - waivering. will decide between wvu, illinois and marsha.
pickett - sees the writing on the wall for him at wvu. pickett is a slot receiver and wvu is loaded at the receiver position with last years class and this years committs. early playing time lured him to marsha.

you say:
go to marsha and win? win what? they have been a 500 or below team for several years now. have never beaten wvu. even with their best team ever against an average or below wvu...... doc is unproven as a head coach. has a reputation as a great recruiter. we will see next year what kind of recruiter he really is..... how many of these kids are committing now because of relationships he built with them while recruiting for wvu? is the marsha name going to get him into houses of these recruits next year?
go to wvu and lose in a bcs conference? when was the last time wvu had a losing record? the frauds first year... 2001 wvu finished 3-8. under stewart wvu has back to back 9-4 seasons with a 3rd and 2nd place finish in the conference

here is another thing to consider.... go to marsha and play in front of 15-20K
or wvu with 55-60k in the stands.....
also who gets more tv exposure?
pizza bowl or bcs bowl?

[Peake]

I have never been a big rivals fan, but to each their own. If you are using numbers according to scout, your numbers are very false.

Why I choose scout over rivals. A good majority of these kids are never seen by rivals in person. I would say over half of the kids ranked by scout have been seen in person at their scout combines. I know after working for scout that very few kids go to rivals sponsored events. JMO

Anyways, Mr. SEC, quite trying to hype up the almighty SEC. They have a ntaural advantage built in. What kid would not want to go where there is sunshine 90% of the time and the worst weather you see is 60 degrees in late November. I don't buy the whole well the SEC is jsut so much better, it has a lot more to do with weather and facilities.

[Speedofsand]

using scout's team rankings, 4 of the top 7 are SEC teams, while the Big 10 has 3 of the top 25.
The last (12th) SEC team is 52nd. The weather and facilities are nice, but the best players year after year in recruiting make SEC football better. Whatever numbers and rankings you want to use, the SEC is better.
WVU may get Ivan McCartney, its either WVU or Miami. His grades have eliminated other schools.

[Peake]

per Scout.com

#1 recruiting Class
2002
1.Texas
2.Oklahoma
3. Ohio State
4. Tennessee
5. Miami, Fl
6. FSU
7. UCLA
8. Texas A&M
9. Georgia
10. Virginia

2003
1. USC
2. LSU
3. Oklahoma
4. Florida
5. Notre Dame
6. Miami, Fl
7. Tennessee
8. Michigan
9. Texas A&M
9. NC State

2004
1. USC
2. LSU
3. Miami, Fl
4. FSU
5. Michigan
6. Georgia
7. Oklahoma
8. Florida
9. Tennessee
10. Texas
10. Ohio State

2005
1. Tennessee
2. Michigan
3. FSU
4. Georgia
5. Oklahoma
6. USC
7. Ohio State
8. Iowa
9. Cal
10. Nebraska

2006
1. USC
2. Florida
3. Texas
4. Georgia
5. Notre Dame
6. Texas
7. Penn State
8 LSU
9 Michigan
9 Oklahoma
9 Auburn

2007
1. Florida
2. USC
3. Texas
4. Tennessee
5. LSU
6. Auburn
7. UNC
8. Pitt
9. Oregon
10. Michigan

2008
1. Bama
2. ND
3. Miami, Fl
4. Ohio State
5. Georgia
6. Michigan
7. LSu
8. FSU
9. USC
10. UCLA

2009
1. Ohio State
2. Alabama
3. LSU
4. Georgia
5. UCLA
6. UNC
7. Texas
8. Tennessee
9. USC
10. Oklahoma

Sinc 2002 the SEC has had 3 teams that have been #1 while USC has been #1 three times themselves and been in the top 10 every single year. It has more to do with who is at the top then who is in the middle. You can argue all you want about the SEC but you see the same teams in the top 10 in recruiting every year and those teams are the ones competing for National Titles.

[Speedofsand]

You switch your argument til you win. From players to 5 stars to only #1 rankings of your polls. Your apples win vs. my oranges. I'm right, the SEC is dominating. The best recruits are going there.

theassassin, Holtz just stole a 4* from FSU.

[Peake]

These are not my polls. I am posting facts. You were wrong and are still wrong. Those teams in the mid-pack of recruiting mean nothing. Call me next time a team outside of the top 10 in recruiting every year wins a National Title. What is your definition of the best recruits?

USC and Texas have two top 10 players, Florida has two, then no other SEC school. The Pac-10 have 3 kids in the top 10 going to their schools, no other conference has more then 2.Texas has 4 kids from the top 20, no one else can top that.

In the top 20 kids the Pac-10 has 5 and the SEC has 6. Not much of a difference.

In the top 50
1. Texas- 6
2. Florida-5
2. USC-5
4. Oklahoma-4

Also, in the top 50 thethe Pac-10 has 9, the SEC has 10, and the Big 12 has 12. Pure SEC dominance. After the top 50 it is basically a crap shoot.

Again the numbers do not lie.

[Speedofsand]

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/recruitin ... eason=2010

http://recruiting.scout.com/a.z?s=73&p= ... 88&yr=2010

http://rivals100.rivals.com/viewrank.as ... a_key=2303

[marshallman]

Lets not forget these 5 star recruits that come in and never produce. Mike DeAndra at OSU, he was like a 10-star recruit at linebacker. He came in with Hawk and Carpenter, never panned out.
Grades, arrests, injuries, drop-outs, transfers and 2-stars out shining a 5-star in fall camps all come in to play. It is a crap shoot but the rankings are good measuring sticks.