OVC & SOC Merge Talk

[goUK]

Coal Grove D6
Rock Hill D6
Oak Hill D6
South Webster n/a
Valley D6
Northwest D5

[522Pirate]

Oak Hill is D6 this year

[mattash]

[baseball16]

Didn’t know you had to vote to discuss. Lol

Smh.

[Omega]

Coal Grove and Gallia Academy have played regularly for probably 60 plus years with an all time record that is very close.

Why is it a problem to play the Blue Devils all of the sudden?

Strong programs like Kirtland, Coldwater, Marion Local, Clinton Massi, etc. play rugged schedules that prepare them for deep playoff runs.

Small town America tends to be tribal. Protective of their own and resistant to change. Maybe Coal Grove yearns for the time 40 years ago when they were the kingpins of OVC football. Maybe for whatever reason they are unwilling or unable to gather the resources to compete with Gallia or Ironton. So why wouldn't Coal Grove or any other school want to find a competitive situation more to their liking?

The MACs, Irontons, Kirklands, and Burgs are few and far between in Ohio. The state sees constant turmoil in conference membership and alignment in the never ending quest for "balanced" competition and shared values.

Yet as in life, sports can never achieve true competitive equity. Given that, is it time for Ohio to abandon the holy grail of conferenes and go to district scheduling? Or is the status quo preferable because it allows adults to play Roger Goodell?

[RollCoal]

I think the biggest issue is, how many schools are willing to hire a coach and allow them to build up the program? How many hire a coach, give them a couple of years and then non renew them and start the cycle all over again?
I would venture to say that, most , of the more successful programs have involvement from the varsity coaches all the way down to the little league level. Rome wasn’t built in a day. It takes a few good years of some growing pains and the kids and community buying into the system a coach puts in place.
Maybe I’m wrong. I’m not a coach. Just a sports fan.

[pmow3]

I love watching these bigger schools complain on here and wonder why the smaller schools want out of conferences or contracts. All these bigger schools love their own situation.
Well. If… and it might be a big if….
But if, these smaller schools can come together and make a conference that is competitive and can fill their schedules with teams that are the same size (not just in enrollment) but In competitive balance, then it will be fun to watch Ironton and Gallia, Wheelersburg, and West have to go compete and play each other or search for games with teams that can match up to them week after week.
That’s all these smaller schools want.

But it seems like every bigger school’s fan base doesn’t want anything to change. Imagine that.

Maybe it doesn’t happen and all the schools that have enrollment advantage or transfer advantage can continue to have their way.

But it’s fun to watch them all complain and hope like hell nothing changes.

Me personally?
I hope Gallia, burg, Ironton, west, Portsmouth Waverly and Fairland all have to go make new schedules. Most will be fine.
I know Burg will. Their program will be just fine.
But all these others on this list? Well. I’d be nervous.

Ironton without the OVC to beat up on may have to go play some very good teams. And travel a great distance. It would be hard to get kids year in and year out that want to transfer or have anything to do with that.

Not trying to offend anyone on here. But the bigger schools are always and only interested in their own situation. I hope the smaller schools throw a big middle finger to some of them and say, we are doing what’s best for us.

[Westfan]

I love watching these bigger schools complain on here and wonder why the smaller schools want out of conferences or contracts. All these bigger schools love their own situation.
Well. If… and it might be a big if….
But if, these smaller schools can come together and make a conference that is competitive and can fill their schedules with teams that are the same size (not just in enrollment) but In competitive balance, then it will be fun to watch Ironton and Gallia, Wheelersburg, and West have to go compete and play each other or search for games with teams that can match up to them week after week.
That’s all these smaller schools want.

But it seems like every bigger school’s fan base doesn’t want anything to change. Imagine that.

Maybe it doesn’t happen and all the schools that have enrollment advantage or transfer advantage can continue to have their way.

But it’s fun to watch them all complain and hope like hell nothing changes.

Me personally?
I hope Gallia, burg, Ironton, west, Portsmouth and Fairland all have to go make new schedules. Most will be fine.
I know Burg will. Their program will be just fine.
But all these others on this list? Well. I’d be nervous.

Ironton without the OVC to beat up on may have to go play some very good teams. And travel a great distance. It would be hard to get kids year in and year out that want to transfer or have anything to do with that.

Not trying to offend anyone on here. But the bigger schools are always and only interested in their own situation. I hope the smaller schools throw a big middle finger to some of them and say, we are doing what’s best for us.

What did West do?

They are probably collateral damage in this.

[pmow3]

West did nothing. I’m just saying. Collateral damage or not, if these schools can come together, you may have to step up and play Ironton or Gallia or you might have to look for games against teams that are your size. When are people gonna look at the enrollment numbers?
Valley and Oak Hill are 60 kids less than you guys 10-12.
I’m sure West and all the bigger schools would love for this to continue. Lol. I would too if I were you. Lmao.

[RBH23]

West did nothing. I’m just saying. Collateral damage or not, if these schools can come together, you may have to step up and play Ironton or Gallia or you might have to look for games against teams that are your size. When are people gonna look at the enrollment numbers?
Valley and Oak Hill are 60 kids less than you guys 10-12.
I’m sure West and all the bigger schools would love for this to continue. Lol. I would too if I were you. Lmao.

In the SOC, West, Burg, Minford, and Northwest are all D5 schools; Waverly is D4. These were the SOC2 football schools at one point with Burg being the smallest of the group; enrollment numbers have obviously changed.

Valley was dominating SOC1 football and wanted to move up to SOC2. For a while, they had success in SOC2 football as well, winning conference titles even as the smallest school. Not sure why the football numbers are now down.

[GoBucks1047]

How's this for an SOC II-OVC merger in football.

Division A:
Gallia Academy
Ironton
Waverly/Portsmouth
West
Burg

Division B:
Minford
Northwest
Oak Hill
Portsmouth/Waverly
Valley

Division C:
Chesapeake
Dawson-Bryant
Fairland
Rock Hill
South Point

Everyone plays their 4 division opponents and maybe require teams play at least 2 teams total from the other 2 divisions. This allows teams to have the flexibility to schedule as they please. I could see Burg scheduling Minford and Valley as their 2 games to go with their 4 division games. In theory, they're replacing Oak Hill with Gallia Academy since they already play Ironton non-conference so nothing different for them. Ironton would probably plays Portsmouth and Fairland. I think West plays Portsmouth, Valley, and Minford.

SOC I:
East
Eastern-Pike
Green
Notre Dame
South Gallia
Symmes Valley

No Football:
Clay
Ironton St. Joe
New Boston
South Webster
Western-Pike

I don't see much need in merging at least the main non-football sports (basketball, volleyball, softball, baseball, boys soccer). I think they can stay as currently done, but you could explore a merger in the other sports.

[pmow3]

No. You are not sure. Because you are doing what everyone else on here is doing. Nobody wants to look at the current enrollment numbers. Or … nobody wants to look at the transfers Ironton or Burg can get, (whether it be high school transfers or 7th grade transfers) those schools have a distinct football advantage.
And the smaller schools can man up for a half a game, but come on man. They can’t go 48 minutes unless it’s a perfect night.

The big schools love their situation. So they bomb anyone on here that complains about it.
And nobody will look at the numbers.
It’s very simple.

Valley
Rock Hill
Coal Grove
Minford
Northwest
Oak hill
Chesapeake
Are all a great match for a conference of their own.

The big schools would be forced to find their own conference. And it would be fun to watch.

[pmow3]

How's this for an SOC II-OVC merger in football.

Division A:
Gallia Academy
Ironton
Waverly/Portsmouth
West
Burg

Division B:
Minford
Northwest
Oak Hill
Portsmouth/Waverly
Valley

Division C:
Chesapeake
Dawson-Bryant
Fairland
Rock Hill
South Point

Everyone plays their 4 division opponents and maybe require teams play at least 2 teams total from the other 2 divisions. This allows teams to have the flexibility to schedule as they please. I could see Burg scheduling Minford and Valley as their 2 games to go with their 4 division games. In theory, they're replacing Oak Hill with Gallia Academy since they already play Ironton non-conference so nothing different for them. Ironton would probably plays Portsmouth and Fairland. I think West plays Portsmouth, Valley, and Minford.

It’s a great idea Go Bucks.
But nobody wants Ironton in a football conference. That is what this is all about.

[RBH23]

No. You are not sure. Because you are doing what everyone else on here is doing. Nobody wants to look at the current enrollment numbers. Or … nobody wants to look at the transfers Ironton or Burg can get, (whether it be high school transfers or 7th grade transfers) those schools have a distinct football advantage.
And the smaller schools can man up for a half a game, but come on man. They can’t go 48 minutes unless it’s a perfect night.

The big schools love their situation. So they bomb anyone on here that complains about it.
And nobody will look at the numbers.
It’s very simple.

Valley
Rock Hill
Coal Grove
Minford
Northwest
Oak hill
Chesapeake
Are all a great match for a conference of their own.

The big schools would be forced to find their own conference. And it would be fun to watch.

Minford and Northwest are not small schools, and despite Minford’s lack of success winning football conference titles, they do very well in other sports.

For example: Minford won SOC in girls soccer and was co-champ in boys soccer. Minford also does well in basketball and baseball.

Might come as a surprise, but there are other sports outside of football.

[pmow3]

Schools would rather walk from the Ironton situation than to play them every year. Or deal with the transfer advantage they have.

I’m not here to knock what Trevon has done for their program. Not at all. He has created a situation that is very desirable for any kid to come to that school. Good for him.

But…. What does that make all the other schools do? Just take it? Just accept the situation that they can’t keep their kids at their school then go take a 50-6 whipping at the tank? Seriously?
If you’re the small schools or the just the schools that are losing transfers to Ironton or burg or wherever, what’s the smart thing to do??
Align yourself with comparable schools and competitive balance. And force the bigger schools or the great recruiting schools to go find their own way….

[pmow3]

RBH 23…

I’m not here to argue school size or argue anything other than football.
I’m here to argue football and competitive balance.
Enrollment has a part in it. But it’s not the final thing.

You look at competitive balance and what is best for your school.

[RBH23]

Schools would rather walk from the Ironton situation than to play them every year. Or deal with the transfer advantage they have.

I’m not here to knock what Trevon has done for their program. Not at all. He has created a situation that is very desirable for any kid to come to that school. Good for him.

But…. What does that make all the other schools do? Just take it? Just accept the situation that they can’t keep their kids at their school then go take a 50-6 whipping at the tank? Seriously?
If you’re the small schools or the just the schools that are losing transfers to Ironton or burg or wherever, what’s the smart thing to do??
Align yourself with comparable schools and competitive balance. And force the bigger schools or the great recruiting schools to go find their own way….

You keep speaking about Burg’s transfer/recruits. Who are these kids you speak of? Which players on this team transferred in or were recruited to play football? If you are going to make these claims about Burg, give names, not just talk in generalities.

[pmow3]

I don’t have specifics. The schools know the truth. The people on here simply speculate. I’m sorry if I accuse any school of recruiting or having transfers. I believe it happens. If I’m wrong I apologize.

I’m not getting into specifics.

But I’ll say this. If you live in Scioto Co, it is not uncommon to hear of kids wanting to go to burg. It starts in 6th 7th grades.
The same thing has happened for years in Lawrence county. And Ironton.

I’m just saying. If you are the other schools, how would you combat that?
I say you combat that with a competitive conference that leaves out the ones that are known to have a competitive advantage.

[RBH23]

RBH 23…

I’m not here to argue school size or argue anything other than football.
I’m here to argue football and competitive balance.
Enrollment has a part in it. But it’s not the final thing.

You look at competitive balance and what is best for your school.

Okay, adding competitive balance into the mix:

Burg has 56 less boys than Waverly. 20 more than Minford. 28 more than West. And 32 more than Northwest.

So your description of Minford being such a “small” school is extremely exaggerated. And if numbers are all that matter, Waverly should be dominating the SOC2 with their massive advantage.

[pmow3]

There have been rumors that Ironton has an incredible advantage on their staff with getting kids to transfer there. I’m not stating anything that hasn’t been said on here for 4 years.
Burg has an amazing program. Their intrigue comes from a different avenue or direction. But it is still something that I believe goes on.
Congratulations to both schools.

But go find your own teams to play is what I would say if I were the others in these 2 counties. There isn’t enough talent in Scioto and Lawrence to level out the smaller schools to Ironton or burg.
Plus they get a few guys from these schools. What do you want these schools to do?