Valley 21 - West 17

johndeere · Post by **johndeere** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 11:11 am

I was not at the game last night!! But I do have comments about officiating that I have seen this year. I have watched 7 varsity football games this year and: 1) The majority of officials are out of shape!!! I watched Minford @ West last week and there wasn't one official under say 240, the biggest looked 300-not muscle, I MEAN FAT!!!! I saw several instances where they were out of position and couldn't make a call!!! The umpire could barely walk!!!! I think there should be some standard of conditioning they all are upheld to!!!! 2) SCHOOLS in football hire the officials !!!! You will/are getting crews who favor the home team (Period) FOOTBALL needs to go to an assigner like basketball does. The assigner does take away a crew doing several home games for one team (PERIOD) I"M NOT TALKING ABOUT LAST NIGHT"S GAME< I WAS NOT THERE NOR HAVE I WATCHED IT !!! 3) TO ALL OFFICIALS, TO ALL OFFICIALS, TO ALL OFFICIALS-YOU should NEVER call a game in the DISTRICT you live or where your kids go to that school or the SCHOOL you GRADUATED from (PERIOD) I don't care if you are the best official in the state, you are in a no win situation. If you call a great game, someone will say you are partial for the other team!!! My point is that it is UNETHICAL for you to call ANY SPORT-FOOTBALL<BASKETBALL<BASEBALL<VOLLEYBALL<SOCCER, etc.....from your SCHOOL!!! 4) TO ALL OFFICIALS-No matter what sport you are officiating, GET IN SHAPE!!! Round is a shape but not for officiating!!!!!!!

playa_44 · Post by **playa_44** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 11:13 am

Watch the film. :oops:

Sickening.

WestSportsFan · Post by **WestSportsFan** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 11:20 am

sportsfan43 wrote:
WestSportsFan wrote:Good job boys in a hard fought game. Keep your heads up and make the best of the next two games. Sometimes the best teams don't always come out with the W, as in this case. Breaks and a little luck help a team get the Win at time. You are a young solid team with a chance for a good run the next 3 to 4 years (as the outcome of the JV game will show this). I can say from watching the game that the best team didn't win and my opinion as everyone here seems to have one that Valley's wins are over unless Minford and Burg just doesn't show up to play. I'm glad to see that the focus of unsportmanship has made it to other schools. (ex. after a punt return some blocking going on and all of sudden a Valley player jumps on top of a West player and starts throwing punches then 2 to 3 other players get in the face of the West player that was down). oops I forgot to mention no flag on this play as well as the several face masks to Pendleton.

again?

if west keps getting beat by teams worse then them, whos fault is it?

is it time for a change?

Did you see in my post that I said all teams that beat West was worse then them? I didn't think so. Minford by far was the better team, Portsmouth maybe equal although I have spoke with a few Portsmouth fans that said the better team didn't win. And to be quite honest I don't believe that West was supposed to come out and go undefeated this year as the team that went 11-0 last year didn't the prior year. The target is always on the defending winners. Talk to you in week 11 when the 2 best SOC teams are in the playoffs!!!

Bo_Diaz · Post by **Bo_Diaz** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 11:44 am

So, let me get this straight -- Valley after losing their best defensive player and holding West to 1 offensive TD on a drive that started in Valley territory, is not only NOT the better team but the "REFS" played a major role in the Indians winning the ballgame? It's really not even possible that Valley is a good team... they have NO business being on the field with West because West won big last year, and has dominated Valley since the 1960's.

Wow, do you want some cheese with that wine?! Or maybe you want some vienna sausages?

All I know is that ballgame played out just like most reasonable posters predicted. It was a close hard fought football game, just like any body that isn't a biased blowhard could see it would be.

Give the kids from Lucasville some credit for fighting back and playing a tough defensive game, even when #10 went down early. This team is full of fight and they are a very young team. Just acknowledge y'all were wrong and eat your crow like men... or boys, whatever you are.

OldBlue · Post by **OldBlue** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 11:45 am

First off. BOO HOO I have never seen a bigger bunch of whiners then the West fans on this site. :roll:

Secondly CONGRATS to my Alma Mater Valley. Great win guys keep it up! Let's show the SOC big boys we can play with them.

fanatic23 · Post by **fanatic23** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:27 pm

Playa44,

I'm as big of west fan as there is but the reason we lost the game last night was our own fault. Instead of blaming the officials lets start asking questions.
1. What do we do all week in practice it can't be much?
2. How do you use three timeouts in the first 5 minutes of the 3rd quarter?
3. Why do you practice certain plays all week and then forget about them during the game?
4. Why is your best cover corner on the bench?
5. Who calls the offensive plays?
6. Does he listen to the guys in the booth
7. Why do we run the ball to the short side of the field every single play?
8. Why do we wiat to pass on 3rd and 20?
9. What happened to play action on 1st down?
10. How long will the coaching staff wait before they realize what they are doing won't work against good teams?
11. Do we have more formations than play?

Now to me these are good questions that west fans should awnser before we blame anyone. We have been out played the last 2 weeks plain and simple. We are way to easy to scout and run first and if it don't work run the same play again. I hear the coaches on top of the press box saying try this or this is wide open why is the offensive coach not listening. To me the kids are playing hard it's just lack of preperation (3 timeouts in 5 minutes) and playcalling. So west fans until we turn the page in the playbook, get used to losing to well coached teams. I'm not saying we don't have good coaches they just need to remember thier a team also and listen to one another.Remember the key to having a good offense is keeping the defense on thier toes. It's hard for 7 guys to block 11 guys that knows where the ball is going.

Post by **coop** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:32 pm

fanatic23 wrote:Playa44,

I'm as big of west fan as there is but the reason we lost the game last night was our own fault. Instead of blaming the officials lets start asking questions.
1. What do we do all week in practice it can't be much?
2. How do you use three timeouts in the first 5 minutes of the 3rd quarter?
3. Why do you practice certain plays all week and then forget about them during the game?
4. Why is your best cover corner on the bench?
5. Who calls the offensive plays?
6. Does he listen to the guys in the booth
7. Why do we run the ball to the short side of the field every single play?
8. Why do we wiat to pass on 3rd and 20?
9. What happened to play action on 1st down?
10. How long will the coaching staff wait before they realize what they are doing won't work against good teams?
11. Do we have more formations than play?

Now to me these are good questions that west fans should awnser before we blame anyone. We have been out played the last 2 weeks plain and simple. We are way to easy to scout and run first and if it don't work run the same play again. I hear the coaches on top of the press box saying try this or this is wide open why is the offensive coach not listening. To me the kids are playing hard it's just lack of preperation (3 timeouts in 5 minutes) and playcalling. So west fans until we turn the page in the playbook, get used to losing to well coached teams. I'm not saying we don't have good coaches they just need to remember thier a team also and listen to one another.Remember the key to having a good offense is keeping the defense on thier toes. It's hard for 7 guys to block 11 guys that knows where the ball is going.

GREAT Post, and thank you.

LICKING COUNTY FAN · Post by **LICKING COUNTY FAN** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:36 pm

I did not think Valley would win but I am happy they were able to beat a good team in West.

playa_44 · Post by **playa_44** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:39 pm

Wow..you are all that just like every other arm chair quarterback fanatic23, now aren't you? What wrong, your boy didn't get to play enough?

HERD07 · Post by **HERD07** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:58 pm

I may come to regret getting involved in this, but here are the penalties on West from our stats, and keep in mind our stats are very unofficial, but not too far off.

- Illegal Procedure Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Illegal Procedure Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Illegal Procedure Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Offside Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Illegal Procedure Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Illegal Procedure Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Illegal Block in Back Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Offside Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Illegal Procedure Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Intentional Grounding Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down
- Delay of Game Penalty(WHS) - Repeat Down

Now I'm not an official, but I know football enough to know that Illegal Procedure block in the back, delay of game and offsides penalties are pretty cut and dry and are not "judgement" calls like rouging the passer and personal foul type penalties. Either you commit them or you don't. So of the 12 penalties above, 10 fall into the cut and dry category. You can argue about the officials if you want, but 10 penalties were caused by West shooting themselves in the foot. If a guy jumps offsides or lines up wrong or lets the play clock run out those are self inflicted penalites.

Take it for what it's worth.

fanatic23 · Post by **fanatic23** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:11 pm

playa_44 wrote:Wow..you are all that just like every other arm chair quarterback fanatic23, now aren't you? What wrong, your boy didn't get to play enough?

No thats not it my boys are way to young. I'm just smart enough to see the big picture and not blinded by a 10-0 season with a team loaded with talent. I haven't missed a game in 2 years and played football my whole life. By any means not saying we have bad coaching think the coaches are great for the kids.I just think we need to change things up a little on play calling. Now playa awnser those questions I posted and tell me what you thinks wrong. Just quit saying it's because were young or the refs because valleys as young as we are.

maybe the next game sit and try to guess what wests next play is going to be , where it's going to go and who's going to get it. Then do Northwest , I just bet you get wests right 75% of the time and the opposing teams 10%-20% of the time. So what do you think the opposing defense is thinking.

F-4 Phantom · Post by **F-4 Phantom** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:15 pm

For those who were not at the game, West was gasping for air on defense the last 8 minutes of the game. If I were the coach, I would be more concerned over that fact, than a blown call or two. Valley was the better conditioned team and the proof is in the quality of play in the 4th quarter.

Say what you want, complain/whine all you want, the fact is the defense was doubled over after every play in the 4th. Best of luck the remainder of the season.

BTW, if you score, the ref's don't come into play. Meaning, if your team was so dominant, a blown call or two could never change an outcome of a game. Some on here act as though West ran up and down the field on Valley. It's amazing. I'm not so sure we were at the same game.

Westfan · Post by **Westfan** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:29 pm

We lost. The game was horribly officiated. No doubt about that. Even the Valley posters have recognized this.

The thing is, the game should never had come to that. Had West not put the ball on the ground, whether they were legitimate fumbles or not, West would have won going away. They are young kids. It happens. They need to learn from the mistakes and get better.

What is weird, is how this season has turning earily similar to the 07 season. I thought that team quit. I don't think this team has or will. What they need to do is finish up strong (beat NW and play Burg tough) and have the same kind of offseason that they have had the last 2. If they do, they could be awsome next year. If they have bad attitudes, we could really start a downward spiral, which would really suck considering the talent that's in that high school right now.

I don't like some things I saw either, from the coaching on down. But you've got to remember, they started 4 sophs and 2 juniors from TE to TE upfront and a sophomore QB. The best player is only a junior. The defense is just as young. They have a great freshmen team with 3 or 4 kids who will be stars. Keep the faith and watch them grow. Theirs going to be alot of paybacks in the next 3 years with this bunch.

SSU Grad · Post by **SSU Grad** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:38 pm

I've got a question. Does Valley play "We are the champions" on the P.A. after every home win or only after they realize they are going to finish 3rd in the SOC instead of 4th like they usually do?

gunit · Post by **gunit** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:46 pm

Congratulations to Valley on the win

HERD07 · Post by **HERD07** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:53 pm

RE: We are the Champions. That's the first I've heard it in the 4 years I've been doing VSN. A few of us on the VSN crew looked at each other and then turned to the PA guys and said it's a little too early to be playing that. There is a lot of football to be played.

Westfan · Post by **Westfan** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:58 pm

I wondered the same thing SSU. It's a big thing to beat West. These teams are fired up to play West, and whether West had came in undefeated or had not won a game, they would still act like they won the Super Bowl.

Just thinking about this game and others throughout the season, there is one thing that really ticks me off. That is players from other teams starting stuff like was mentioned with Pendelton. If a West player had did that he would have been flagged or probably ejected. I have never been a fan of the personal fouls and such. This coaching staff finally gets the kids to act respectable and play the game right, but because of our HISTORY, these kids still get talked about like their problem children. Minford last week had a kid on kickoffs who acted like a Thug, pure and simple. He tried to stuff all night. Was never called. Finally a West player, who is a great young man, took up for himself and got flagged. Portsmouth stood over our QB and Pendelton at different times and taunted them. No flag. Valley punches a kid with a ref right beside him. No flag. Its a buch of crap that needs to stop. West has a bunch of really good young men. It isn't fair to hold them responsible for things that may have happened before they were born.

playa_44 · Post by **playa_44** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 3:01 pm

Well, I seldom post on any thread, just read. This is the exception. First of all, if I were fanatic23 and thought I had the lowdown on why, what, where, and how the doer of the deeds could have done them better I'd share that info with the West staff, not online. Especially since the staff at West is underpaid and overworked maybe they could use your expertise. Get in their and volunteer instead of B....! Second, most of the time, reading this crap, when a team loses, no matter what school, this s.... starts from fans who know best how to coach their teams to the state, if only someone would pay attention. Third, the voice of reason from West always tends to be siderman. If you want to know how things really are and not at the extremes, just read what he has to say...usually his common sense and sense of football are genuine. Nice to see on these forums(and unusual). I stand by my posts that started all this...the refs were horrible last night. When a "fumble" occurs and both offense and defense have an equal hand on the ball, it should go to offense. Not so last night. There were so many things wrong with the officiating that it was amazing. Doubt there is anyone the officials answer to, but in this case, there should be. Again, maybe the outcome would have been the same, no one knows. Valley capitalized on lopsided officiating. Not the players' or the fans fault.

fuzzhead · Post by **fuzzhead** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 3:12 pm

SSU Grad wrote:I've got a question. Does Valley play "We are the champions" on the P.A. after every home win or only after they realize they are going to finish 3rd in the SOC instead of 4th like they usually do?

Incognito · Post by **Incognito** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 4:06 pm

siderman wrote:I wondered the same thing SSU. It's a big thing to beat West. These teams are fired up to play West, and whether West had came in undefeated or had not won a game, they would still act like they won the Super Bowl.

Just thinking about this game and others throughout the season, there is one thing that really ticks me off. That is players from other teams starting stuff like was mentioned with Pendelton. If a West player had did that he would have been flagged or probably ejected. I have never been a fan of the personal fouls and such. This coaching staff finally gets the kids to act respectable and play the game right, but because of our HISTORY, these kids still get talked about like their problem children. Minford last week had a kid on kickoffs who acted like a Thug, pure and simple. He tried to stuff all night. Was never called. Finally a West player, who is a great young man, took up for himself and got flagged. Portsmouth stood over our QB and Pendelton at different times and taunted them. No flag. Valley punches a kid with a ref right beside him. No flag. Its a buch of crap that needs to stop. West has a bunch of really good young men. It isn't fair to hold them responsible for things that may have happened before they were born.

Dont forget to mention Pendelton's cheap shot on Oesch in the 4th quarter against Minford. O wait, had to be Oesch's fault right? :roll:

Dont act all high and mighty thinking people are out to get West or whatever. West dishes out cheapshots as well. Take your blinders off.

SoutheasternOhioPreps.com

Valley 21 - West 17

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