Is Zanesville leaving the SEOAL after the 2008-2009 season?

Army · Post by **Army** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 9:12 am

bcnu · Post by **bcnu** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:11 am

http://www.athensmessenger.com/main.asp ... cleID=7898

someoverkill · Post by **someoverkill** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:37 am

"Is Zanesville leaving?" Reading that article, I see no question about it. Does that change others minds about leaving?

Army · Post by **Army** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:46 am

someoverkill wrote:"Is Zanesville leaving?" Reading that article, I see no question about it. Does that change others minds about leaving?

someoverkill,

Good Question

I still see Ironton Exiting.....I will be totally surprised if they stay in the SEOAL.

Will Vincent Warren-Local re-think the possibility to go back to the TVC-Ohio

Or stay in the SEOAL

If Vincent Warren Local leaves to go back to the TVC, will Marietta stay in the SEOAL

Will Portsmouth stay if Ironton leaves

If Portsmouth, Marietta, Vincent Warren Local, Ironton, leave as the two last ones noted are, or will have departed, those being, i.e., Zanesville and The Plains Athens......will Chillicothe stay with only Jackson, Gallipolis and Logan in a 4 Team SEOAL

Time will only tell

Army

loganlocos · Post by **loganlocos** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:47 am

http://www.logandaily.com/main.asp?Sect ... eID=124394

It's in the Logan Daily today as well.

ChiefCruiser95 · Post by **ChiefCruiser95** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:21 am

someoverkill wrote:"Is Zanesville leaving?" Reading that article, I see no question about it. Does that change others minds about leaving?

I think it might IMHO. Up until now it seemed as though Zanesville was very committed to the SEOAL. Wow what a shocker!! I agree with Army in Ironton leaving as well unfortunately.
I don't want to seem all doom and gloom about things but this could very well start a trend in the coming years. I know that it's been said that everyone knew about the travel when they voted to come in the league, but did they really know. Cost estimates and studies can only take you so far but when you see the product in front of you is when you get the true real life results. Upon reading the article it appears IMO that this was the case with Zanesville. Sad as it is to see happen, I think it may continue.

Zanes-Vegas · Post by **Zanes-Vegas** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:33 am

And I tend to agree with that, ChiefCruiser95.

When we joined, fuel costs were nowhere near where they are now ... and the projections are that they'll only get worse. That MUST be taken under consideration. Especially for a school such as ours, which is a virtual outpost, geographically speaking.

At Zanesville, we do charge what many would call a "pay to participate" fee. That's not wholly correct, at least in how it's usually defined. ALL of this fee is used to defray transportation costs for those activities that use it (so it includes cheerleaders, the marching band, etc.). None goes to equipment, salaries, officials ... just transportation.

This is the fourth year of it, I think. The original fee was raised after one year, but we've had to do everything we can to hold it steady since then because -- as expected -- it began to erode participation levels. It's becoming especially prevalent in our middle schools, most notably at Grover Cleveland MS on our south side. While the fee pales in comparison to some schools' fees, we believe it to be a major impediment, especially in a district that has seen a steady decline in enrollment over the past few years.

Certainly, every school in the SEOAL should be considering its finances as it relates to athletics. Zanesville tends to "travel well," but my observations over the past two years is that MOST other league schools do not. Some of that, certainly, is predicated on "interest," but I also think a good portion of it is due to travel time and distance (not to mention that MOST of the routes are not exactly easy drives).

warrnwarriorfan · Post by **warrnwarriorfan** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:34 am

While Warren might be a good fit in the TVC for a variety of reasons (travel, size, demographics, etc.) my understanding is the TVC recently voted to NOT let Warren re-enter.

Warren is seen as too competitive.

fighting_falcon · Post by **fighting_falcon** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:36 am

Zanesville talks about other teams not traveling well. I was at the Warren vs Zanesville game in girls basketball this year played at Zanesville and there were not many Zanesville fans in the stands. The crowd was small. If you won't support your team at home then it won't matter what league you are in, finances come into play.

Zanes-Vegas · Post by **Zanes-Vegas** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:44 am

Falcon ...

With the exception of a small handful of girls basketball programs I've seen over my many years, there are rarely many fans at their games.

Warren has a long tradition in girls basketball. Ours has been sporadic. When they're winning, they draw fans. Right now, they're .500, and that's just not a big enough draw.

Also, as Scott was quoted in the article, we hosted Tri-Valley (about 10 miles to our north) a week or so ago and had a $2,200 gate. Bottom line is that our fans don't really understand (or, also, care) that Warren is a quality girls basketball program, too. And that would take YEARS to establish in their minds.

Lastly, when it comes to "travelling well," that is mostly for the two main revenue sports -- football and boys basketball. Those are the two that pay the bills at virtually EVERY school. Any other generated revenues are just icing on that cake.

loganlocos · Post by **loganlocos** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 12:40 pm

The TVC doesn't seem to have any real interest in Warren, whether Warren has interest I don't know.

With ZHS leaving, Ironton may be willing to reconsider staying in this league.

IMO, Chillicothe, Portsmouth, Gallipolis, Logan, Jackson, Marietta, and Warren (in that order) are not going anywhere. I believe the league is willing to negotiate to keep Ironton as a member, but I don't think they are willing to give away the farm either to keep the Tigers.

If the league can keep Ironton, they have a perfect one-division set up for football (7 league games weeks 4-10). If you move Jackson or Gallipolis (preferably Jackson) to the North division, and play the double round robin for intra-division games and single round robing for inter-division games you have 10 league games plus the day of champions in other sports.

Army · Post by **Army** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 12:46 pm

LoganLocos wrote:The TVC doesn't seem to have any real interest in Warren, whether Warren has interest I don't know.

With ZHS leaving, Ironton may be willing to reconsider staying in this league.

IMO, Chillicothe, Portsmouth, Gallipolis, Logan, Jackson, Marietta, and Warren (in that order) are not going anywhere. I believe the league is willing to negotiate to keep Ironton as a member, but I don't think they are willing to give away the farm either to keep the Tigers.

If the league can keep Ironton, they have a perfect one-division set up for football (7 league games weeks 4-10). If you move Jackson or Gallipolis (preferably Jackson) to the North division, and play the double round robin for intra-division games and single round robing for inter-division games you have 10 league games plus the day of champions in other sports.

Locos......you got a PM

Army

ironman02 · Post by **ironman02** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 1:17 pm

Well, you can't say that we didn't see this coming. Despite the statements saying that Zanesville is committed to the SEOAL, it is apparent that they have been looking to get out for quite a while now. All those "rumors" were exactly what we thought they were.

I can't blame Zanesville though. It's smart for them to evaluate the situation based on travel concerns and money generated from playing schools who are closer in proximity. I hate to see Zanesville leave, but this is probably the best decision for their athletic program.

Once again, it seems that Jackson could see this coming from the beginning. I wanted this expansion as much as anyone, but I can definitely see why Jackson voted no for expansion. I do like the fact that the SEOAL will be gaining Chillicothe and Portsmouth out of this whole deal though. Hopefully with the departure of Zanesville, Ironton will consider staying also, but I'm not going to get my hopes up.

A league composed of Jackson, Logan, Chillicothe, GAHS, Portsmouth, Marietta, Warren, and possibly Ironton is still very strong.

qualified101 · Post by **qualified101** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 2:56 pm

need to go to one division and play everybody.

Zanes-Vegas · Post by **Zanes-Vegas** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:00 pm

In terms of football, it doesn't make sense to have a two-division alignment in an 8-team league.

BTW, our board meeting isn't until next Thursday. But this is a slam dunk anyway.

Ben Buckles · Post by **Ben Buckles** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:03 pm

All you have to do is go to Jackson and talk to the former AD Jim Reynolds. He took way too much heat for being the only AD/Principal with balls enough to vote no on the expansion. He took heat because people said Jackson was afraid of the impending competition. Believe what you want to. Howver, Mr. Reynolds told eveyone that the league would last 5 years at the most. He talked about future transportation costs (fuel/drivers pay/wear and tear on buses etc) and the fact that he felt that Ironton, Portsmouth, Zanesville, and one of the Terrible Three (Athens/Warren/Marietta) would leave the league. If it gets to a 4 team league, good luck with a schedule. 3-4 league game a year . . . I guess Logan could pick-up Cardinal Mooney, DeSales, Watterson, Upper Arlington etc to fix their schedule. I wonder how the powerful Chieftains would fair with that schedule. Would that make you happy Paladin? Oh, I forgot . . . Logan turned down Cardinal Mooney a home/home game. Not picking on Logan here. They have a great coach/person in Coach Amyx and a very good program. However, there are some Chief fans on here that don't live in reality. There might just be a light at the end of the tunnel . . . a freight train headed right at the remaining league teams.

Post by **noreply66** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:13 pm

How did this turn in to a Logan thing.

Mr. Dunns article in the Logan Daily says a lot about how Zanesville went about it. Before jumping on Zanesville, as we did Athens and as some did when there was talk about Ironton leaving,this article needs read.

Zanes-Vegas · Post by **Zanes-Vegas** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:15 pm

Dude, from experience here recently, EVERYTHING is a "Logan thing." :lol:

ironman02 · Post by **ironman02** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:21 pm

no reply,

Zanesville is doing what they feel is best for their athletic program. However, if Jim Reynolds could look down the road and see possible problems that could arise, why couldn't anyone else? Zanesville realized that there would be LONG road trips involved in this league and gas wasn't what you would call cheap when this expansion was voted on. I'm not going to say that what Zanesville is doing should be compared to the way that Athens handled things, but Zanesville could have seen this coming before they joined the SEOAL so they don't get a free pass in my opinion.

As Ben Buckles alluded to, everyone jumped all over Jackson for voting no to expansion. Turns out that Jackson was the only one who really thought this thing through.

Army · Post by **Army** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:31 pm

Ben Buckles,

I know Chillicothe is here to stay in the SEOAL unless the situation you just posed on here , actually took place. Then if it actually did, I could see Chilli petitioning the MSL-Buckeye for the CAVS to join. If the MSL-Buckeye agreed, I bet Chillicothe would jump, due to it being in Chilli's backyard. Another option would be to join the SCOL.

Well we will have to wait and see how this all works out.

What is the old saying....patience is virtue

I know the three original members aren't going anywhere and if Portsmouth stays so will Chillicothe.

I can't see Vincent Warren-Local going anywhere either, unless the MVL invites them in. Then I could see the Warriors leaving. It seems the TVC-Ohio has said no.. to letting them back in. Something I did not know, until reading it on here. I would say Ironton will still go unless they fool me and many others on here. I would hope they stay.

I really don't know much about Marietta's allegience, although they have been in the SEOAL now for what...23 years? But I have heard rumors about the Tigers looking elsewhere.

So your (2009-2010) SEOAL Football Season could look like this:

Chillicothe
Portsmouth
Gallipolis
Vincent Warren-Local
Jackson
Logan

or:

Chillicothe
Portsmouth
Gallipolis
Vincent Warren-Local
Marietta
Jackson
Logan

or:

Chillicothe
Portsmouth
Ironton
Gallipolis
Vincent Warren-Local
Marietta
Jackson
Logan

We will just have to wait and see huh

ARMY